Possible new rider with questions

[Buggs1a]

Hi all.
I’m having some issues with my car. Now I’m looking to replace it. But I have questions. So I did a search and found this place.

After reading some stuff I get nervous when I hear bad things. But all cars have good and bad.

I need better mpg and good sound and good tech. But under $10k. I’m not working. On gov ssi and ssdi.

My cousin in law is helping a bit. We found a local place that has or had , I dunno, the 2015 BMW i3. Decent price I guess. No clue.

So I’ve been watching a few YouTube vids. I love what I see. So far. But I have questions.

So I’m introducing myself here as requested. .

I live in Burien Wa. In an apartment.
I’d like to ask a few questions here. Please forgive me if this isn’t the place.

1: Could I use a maybe 100 foot extension cable for charging? Has to go from my apartment to where I can park my car for a few hrs.

2: What about if it’s raining?

3: Does the 2014-2015 i3 have good sound?

4: What trims/models are there? I know of base and range extender. Then I know of stuff for the fabric or something?

5: I’m interested in the 20-4-2015 i3 range extender. Navigation. Good sound. Other stuff like ACC seems cool.

6: I’ve read online of free chargers. Is that true? Charging station.

7: How can I find where charging stations are? Is there an app like Tesla has that will show this on gps map like Tesla?

8: Is there a nice BMW app to manage the car/charging like Tesla has?

9: Can you get charging cost info? I think the Tesla app shows how much per mile or something. My cousin charges his at home and it seems to know cost per mile or something. But how I wonder. Based on his power company and the app knows or his location.

10: How do you enter in addresses in the nav. Do you just use the dial in the center console area or write out an address?

11: Can you talk to the car and get directions? Say an address or business and nav does the rest?

12: What’s the difference between 2014 range extender and 2015 range extender?

Sorry. I just have questions haha. And thank you.

 

[Mondomensch]

Hi all.
I’m having some issues with my car. Now I’m looking to replace it. But I have questions. So I did a search and found this place.

After reading some stuff I get nervous when I hear bad things. But all cars have good and bad.

I need better mpg and good sound and good tech. But under $10k. I’m not working. On gov ssi and ssdi.

My cousin in law is helping a bit. We found a local place that has or had , I dunno, the 2015 BMW i3. Decent price I guess. No clue.

So I’ve been watching a few YouTube vids. I love what I see. So far. But I have questions.

So I’m introducing myself here as requested. .

I live in Burien Wa. In an apartment.
I’d like to ask a few questions here. Please forgive me if this isn’t the place.

1: Could I use a maybe 100 foot extension cable for charging? Has to go from my apartment to where I can park my car for a few hrs.

2: What about if it’s raining?

3: Does the 2014-2015 i3 have good sound?

4: What trims/models are there? I know of base and range extender. Then I know of stuff for the fabric or something?

5: I’m interested in the 20-4-2015 i3 range extender. Navigation. Good sound. Other stuff like ACC seems cool.

6: I’ve read online of free chargers. Is that true? Charging station.

7: How can I find where charging stations are? Is there an app like Tesla has that will show this on gps map like Tesla?

8: Is there a nice BMW app to manage the car/charging like Tesla has?

9: Can you get charging cost info? I think the Tesla app shows how much per mile or something. My cousin charges his at home and it seems to know cost per mile or something. But how I wonder. Based on his power company and the app knows or his location.

10: How do you enter in addresses in the nav. Do you just use the dial in the center console area or write out an address?

11: Can you talk to the car and get directions? Say an address or business and nav does the rest?

12: What’s the difference between 2014 range extender and 2015 range extender?

Sorry. I just have questions haha. And thank you.

PlugShare is a good umbrella app that covers chargers on the different charging networks. By looking at individual charger details you can find out the price. Most newer ones charge by kWhr (typical to get 4 miles per kWhr), but some usually slower chargers charge by the time you are charging, with a different price for staying parked there once you are done charging.

For good sound, Harmon Kardon option probably necessary.

For an older model like you are thinking about, it may not have the DC fast charging option installed, and due to the shutdown of the 3G cellphone network a few years ago will not have connected services/telematics.

Recent model years have 4G telematics, DC fast charging capability standard and improved base sound system (still may not be up to your standards). Plus of course the bigger 120Ah battery, twice the capacity of the early models.

 

[robthebold]

Well, home charging is gonna be the biggest challenge in your situation, IMO. If you're dealing with a distance from the outlet to the EVSE of 100 feet, you'll want to check the rated current capacity carefully ahead of time, and expect it to be considerably (physically) heavier and more expensive than extension cords most people have on hand. With outdoor usage in mind, you may need to look at the kind they sell for RV hookups and figure that price as well as a rainproof "charger" into your costs --potentially 100s of dollars. And then worry about theft, too.

I don't want to tell you not to get an EV, but you'll want to look carefully at nearby charging options. If there's someplace you regularly spend several hours at a time anyway that has a reasonably priced charging station, it'd make all the difference.

 

[alohart]

After reading some stuff I get nervous when I hear bad things. But all cars have good and bad.

Correct. Few vehicle owners post to vehicle fora about how trouble-free their vehicles have been, so problems seem more common than they really are. We bought a 2014 i3 BEV new, replaced it with a used 2019 i3 BEV, and replaced that with a 2021 i3 BEV just so we could own the final U.S. year model. Over almost exactly 10 years of i3 ownership, we have not experienced a single problem that would require a repair.

I need better mpg and good sound and good tech. But under $10k. I’m not working. On gov ssi and ssdi.

My cousin in law is helping a bit. We found a local place that has or had , I dunno, the 2015 BMW i3. Decent price I guess. No clue.

Given a choice, I would avoid a 2016 or earlier i3 because some of their battery packs degraded more rapidly than expected reducing an already low range. However, by now any such rapid degradation would be noticeable if one knew what to expect.

If you could find a suitable 2017 or later i3, its battery pack would have ~50% greater usable capacity than earlier models. It would also have a 4G telematics module so could be controlled and monitored remotely using the My BMW smartphone app which earlier models with their 3G telematics modules could not do.

1: Could I use a maybe 100 foot extension cable for charging? Has to go from my apartment to where I can park my car for a few hrs.

This extension cord would need to be heavy-duty to avoid too much voltage loss over 100' and overheating of its plug and/or receptacle. The receptacle into which this extension cord would be plugged would need to be in excellent condition to avoid overheating because charging would likely need to be 10A with most residential receptacles rated at 15A. No other loads should be on the same circuit as this outlet to avoid tripping its circuit breaker. This extension cord should not pose a tripping hazard to anyone who would walk across it.

If you have an assigned parking space, having a charging circuit installed would be a far better solution.

2: What about if it’s raining?

The charging circuit between the charging station and the EV has protections against electrocution including during rainy conditions. However, the segment between your apartment receptacle and your charging station would not have these protections and could short-circuit if rainwater entered the extension cord's receptacle.

3: Does the 2014-2015 i3 have good sound?

An i3 would need to have the optional Harman/Kardon entertainment system to have the best sound. The base entertainment system has only 4 speakers, all of them in the front.

4: What trims/models are there? I know of base and range extender. Then I know of stuff for the fabric or something?

Deka World (not in earlier U.S. i3's): dark cloth upholstery, might be missing some features like universal garage door opener, some interior LED's
Mega World: gray cloth and synthetic leather upholstery, has some additional features
Giga World: wool and tan or light brown leather upholstery, wood dashboard trim, has even more features
Tera World: all dark brown leather interior, wood dashboard trim, has the most features.

5: I’m interested in the 20-4-2015 i3 range extender. Navigation. Good sound. Other stuff like ACC seems cool.

ACC is included in the Technology & Driving Assistant package which also includes a wider navigation screen and other nice features.

6: I’ve read online of free chargers. Is that true? Charging station.

Some public AC Level 2 (208V-240V) charging stations are available at no cost, usually to promote a shopping center or business that installed and maintain them. An AC Level 2 charging station can add ~25 miles of range per hour of charging.

7: How can I find where charging stations are? Is there an app like Tesla has that will show this on gps map like Tesla?

8: Is there a nice BMW app to manage the car/charging like Tesla has?

The My BMW app can show public charging stations and manage an i3, but this app works only with 2017 and later i3's. The PlugShare app shows even more charging stations.

9: Can you get charging cost info? I think the Tesla app shows how much per mile or something. My cousin charges his at home and it seems to know cost per mile or something. But how I wonder. Based on his power company and the app knows or his location.

The My BMW app allows one to enter his electricity rate and records a charging history including cost. The i3's technology is basically a decade old so doesn't have the features of a Tesla.

10: How do you enter in addresses in the nav. Do you just use the dial in the center console area or write out an address?

The iDrive controller can enter an address tediously, i3's with the Tech & Driving Assist package include a touch-sensitive top surface on the iDrive controller allowing an address to be entered by drawing the characters with one's finger (slightly less tedious). I usually send navigation addresses to our i3 from the My BMW app.

11: Can you talk to the car and get directions? Say an address or business and nav does the rest?

Theoretically, but I haven't had much luck entering addresses with voice commands. The navigation system doesn't understand Hawaiian business or street names very well

12: What’s the difference between 2014 range extender and 2015 range extender?

In the U.S., the 2015 i3 included features that were options on 2014 i3's like DC fast charging, seat and battery pack heaters, and alloy wheels that were the same side-to-side rather than having right and left wheels. There aren't major differences.

 

[Buggs1a]

Thanks a lot.
I think I just want the nav. Good sound. And the acc feature set. A 2014 for $7k or so I found has this. 94k miles I think. Has everything.

A 2015 I found seems to have the nav and hi speakers but don’t say much else. It’s $8k or $9k. 68k miles I think. The i3 I’ve seen have fast charging I think.

I live in Burien wa. Trying to find a good for me i3 because I’m on disability gov money and don’t have any money really for stuff so I’m trying to get best mpg possible to save on gas.

I don’t go anywhere more than 45 minute one way. That’s on freeway. I have two places. My sisters/parents. 30 minutes. They live together. And cousin 45 minutes. Every where else is within 10 miles one way basically. I don’t drive daily either.

I can charge where I go. Moms and cousins. But that still may be an issue considering that’s losing the charge on my way home. I should be able to charge from my apartment with a long cable.

I couldn’t afford a charge station thing in my parking spot. They’d have to dig up the ground cement etc right? Thousands of dollars I’d guess. This is subsidized housing.

So in this case my issue with charging means get a Prius right? lol. No bmw i3 for me. Unless there was a close charging station I could use but sitting there 30 plus minutes not gonna happen. My charging has to be at my cousins or parents and maybe I can do it here.

My budget is as far under $10k as possible.

I have now a 2013 Ford cmax sel. Its leg room sucks. But other than that it’s ok except I’m trying to improve mpg and leg room by replacing it. And the i3 has better leg room. I’m kinda claustrophobic in my car. It’s been doable tho but I always wanted better room. I need to have my knees open a bit more.

I’m looking BMW i3 2014 with everything for maybe like I said above. Or 2015 as said above. Or 2010 Prius model I guess 4 maybe. Not sure about 3.

 

[Mondomensch]

Remember that if you buy from any dealer (not private party) who knows how to do the correct federal credit paperwork, you can get 30% off up front. That's as long as the car has never had a federal credit applied to it before, is not too old, too expensive, your income last or this year qualifies, etc. The dealership will have to know how to do the correct online instant certification to the government *before* you take delivery.

There may be WA State credits and/or King County credits as well.

Personally, I just charge at local public DC fast chargers. 20 minutes gives me about 15 kWhr of charge (about 60 miles in flat city driving). My house has a clunky old electrical system so I haven't even tried the portable outlet charger.

 

[Buggs1a]

All I know is you get $4k tax credit. That’s it. And no sales tax. At least at one place I saw the 2015 at. And no one in my family pays taxes. I certainly don’t. So this won’t help.

I would need to find a close free or cheap charging station. I could charge here I guess. Sometimes maybe but it’s maybe an issue at home. Less then 100 feet I think.

 

[Mondomensch]

All I know is you get $4k tax credit. That’s it. And no sales tax. At least at one place I saw the 2015 at. And no one in my family pays taxes. I certainly don’t. So this won’t help.

I would need to find a close free or cheap charging station. I could charge here I guess. Sometimes maybe but it’s maybe an issue at home. Less then 100 feet I think.

Check out (somewhat complicated) https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/credits-for-new-clean-vehicles-purchased-in-2023-or-after

The key is that at time of purchase you can sign over the tax credit to the dealer so it doesn’t matter if you don’t pay enough taxes to use it yourself. It acts just like incentive cash in that way. Just make sure the dealer does the right presale government notification and certification paperwork so you’re not left on the hook to repay the credit at tax time because of a dealer mistake.

The credit is 30% up to a max of $4k like you said, so a really cheap car might not get the full amount.

Btw the signing over of the credit etc is new for 2024 so some dealers may not be fully knowledgeable about it yet. If you go this route, make sure you get an official reporting confirmation form from the dealer at time of delivery showing that it was reported to the government and approved by them (instant online process by dealer).

 

[Buggs1a]

Ok. Sounds good and complicated.
So $8k minus $2400 sound right?
If they don’t know this or how to do it what would I do?

I also think Plug Share shows me there’s charging stations near me for the i3. So no problem charging. But how do I know cost? Like per mile or something. Would it be cheaper than gas? My cousin in law says yes.

One last thing here.
How do I check battery strength at the dealer?
How expensive is a replacement? Not the 12 volt or whatever.

Edit.
Looked at yer link.
BMW isn’t available for credit. Huh?

 

[alohart]

We bought our first EV in 2012 with no second vehicle and no way to charge in our apartment parking space. After 2 years of using only free public charging stations that were a 15-minute walk from our apartment, I became really tired of depending on these charging stations being available and not being broken. I vowed to never own another EV that I couldn't charge in our parking space. Depending on public charging stations really reduces the enjoyment of EV ownership.

You could enter the VIN of an i3 of interest at mdecoder.com to learn which options it has. You'd want an i3 with options:

4U7 Rapid Charging, Direct Current
609 Navigation System Professional

I don't know the Harman/Kardon entertainment system option, but you wouldn't want this mutually-exclusive option:

645 BMW US Radio

Because you have no federal income tax liability, you would not qualify for a clean used car tax credit.

A replacement battery pack would cost more than the value of a 2014 or 2015 i3, so you wouldn't want to have to replace it. Those that have been replaced were replaced under BMW's battery pack capacity warranty which would not be in effect for a 2014 or 2015 i3. A BMW dealer would charge a few hundred dollars for a rigorous usable battery capacity test. Trying to determine the battery pack condition by the range estimate on the dashboard would depend on the conditions under which an i3 had been driven for the previous 18 miles and the current ambient temperature which would make this method ineffective.

A hidden service menu displays the battery management system's estimate of the usable capacity. Search YouTube for "BMW i3 hidden menu" to learn how to access it. A dealer might not allow you to access the hidden service menu. BMW considers the new usable capacity to be 18.8 kWh for a 2014-2016 i3, so you could get an estimate of degradation percentage.

If you buy an i3 REx, the battery pack's capacity wouldn't be quite as important because you could drive with the REx engine running. However, its fuel efficiency with the REx engine running isn't as good as a recent Prius, you'd add the cost of annual oil changes, and you'd have a less reliable i3.

 

[Buggs1a]

^^^ you make it sound as if this is a bad car to get. And the guy above you said you still get the credit if you give it to the dealer or something.

Of course free charging would be full more maybe.

I’m not sure if the battery would cost more than $8k. I e heard from YouTube vids not even close. I have no idea.

YouTube liars. I search on google for battery cost. BMW is insane. But you don’t have to pay that. There’s lots of other options.

Anyway I have no idea about this stuff.

 

[alohart]

^^^ you make it sound as if this is a bad car to get. And the guy above you said you still get the credit if you give it to the dealer or something.

It's been the best car for us for a decade. That doesn't mean that it's the best car for everyone.

Every used EV buyer who claims the credit must file Form 8936 with his tax return. A credit is applied against and up to but not more than one's tax liability, so if you have no tax liability, you wouldn't qualify for a credit.

You could claim an instant credit from the dealer. However, when you file your federal tax return, if you don't qualify for all of the credit that you've already received, you would have to repay the excess that you received with your tax return.

I’m not sure if the battery would cost more than $8k. I e heard from YouTube vids not even close. I have no idea.

YouTube liars. I search on google for battery cost. BMW is insane. But you don’t have to pay that. There’s lots of other options.

There aren't many options. One option right now is to buy a used battery pack from a wrecking yard and pay a mechanic to install it. Few mechanics know how to do this. A battery pack is quite heavy. Including the freight from the wrecking, the wrecking yard's price, and the mechanic's labor, I doubt that a used battery pack could be installed for $8k.

A Chinese company has been advertising i3 battery packs with new battery cells of unknown quality but much greater capacity than the 60 Ah battery pack in a 2014 or 2015 i3. I'm not aware of anyone who has risked installing one of these battery packs in their i3.

In the future, more battery pack rebuilders might offer replacement i3 battery packs. However, it's likely that they won't be inexpensive.

Fortunately, 94 Ah (2017-2018) and 120 Ah (2019 and later) i3 battery cells have performed much better than some 60 Ah (2014-2016) battery packs, so few, if any, 2017 and later i3 owners have needed to replace their battery packs.

 

[Buggs1a]

You guys are scaring me. . Make me nervous and confused and stuff.

 

[Mondomensch]

Because you have no federal income tax liability, you would not qualify for a clean used car tax credit.
.

This changed for 2024. At time of purchase, you can assign the tax credit to the dealer for them to use. There are rules and procedures, t's to cross and i's to dot, which must be done before or at the sale completion, but it's doable unless the dealer isn't set up for it.

Here's the government checklist to see if you qualify and the car qualifies:
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p5866a.pdf

alohart is right that you can't get the credit refunded to yourself, but assigning it to the dealer makes it a credit against their taxes, not yours.

From the IRS FAQ on transferring clean vehicle credits (to dealer): at

Topic H — Frequently asked questions about transfer of New Clean Vehicle Credit and Previously Owned Clean Vehicles Credit​

Q4. What if a buyer has insufficient tax liability to fully use a transferred credit? (added Oct. 6, 2023)​

A4. The amount of the credit that the electing taxpayer elects to transfer to the eligible entity may exceed the electing taxpayer's regular tax liability for the taxable year in which the sale occurs, and the excess, if any, is not subject to recapture from the dealer or the buyer.

 

[Buggs1a]

I want to thank everyone so much.
I am scared though. For a few reasons. The unknowns. Battery. And stuff. It’s hard to find the right car. Features I like. Price. Mileage. So depressing. I wish I could have someone do this for me. I don’t know anything and I’m scared. Nervous. Concerned.

I have learned. I have figured out some stuff. So truly thank you guys so much.

I’m concerned what I want isn’t possible. I’m concerned if possible car issues. Battery etc. cousin in law says it not something to worry about the battery. Of course unless it’s way bad. But I dunno how to find out before buying.

I may not even be able to do this.

 

[Buggs1a]

How would EV GO work with the i3? There’s some real close to me. Less then 3 miles away.

 

[Mondomensch]

As long as you have the DC fast charging option in your i3, it works fine. They are one of the major charger networks in my area. Not cheap though, maybe 50-60 cents/kWh (4 miles of range), so maybe the equivalent of $3.50/gallon gasoline.
Their app will show you locations and details like price. You can sign up for monthly plans that reduce the charging cost a bit.

 

[Ollie]

We use Electrify America (EA). We are in the same state of Wa. On our normal long distance overnite trips we find a walmart store with chargers at the end location. Make the run, go shop in the store for what we need, and let the car charge to 80%. Last was .48 to .53 cents kwh. (Our area home charging cost would be .0879 kwh). Quite the difference. Then at our actual end point. We use the slow charge 110v option to complete the charge overnite. I believe if your a member of some charging systems there are discounts. With EA you put money on their/your account and use/add as needed. At home, I don't use the grid. I built a solar system that handles all my charging needs. So my payback is way slower by comparison. Lets call it an even 25 kwh a day. At EV .50 cents $12.5 a day. At a normal home at .0879 $2.20. Where I am $free minus the cost of my system. I should see my break even, probably never, but oh what fun.
Reading between your lines, and to be honest. You should steer clear of an I3 for now. Your at or even below a break even point with the cost of the vehicle, no tax credit, the cost of charging, cost of tires and any repairs over a standard I.C.E.. If one party over the other gets elected. It might be more of a wash. But that's yet to be seen. You can find lower priced reasonable options that your local mechanic can fix. You should maybe look for a hybrid option if your really wanting to move towards electric.
Shop with an eye towards what is practical for you. Don't try to make what others have as practical to fit you. For instance. You mentioned leg room. I have a mini cooper that I have put almost 200,000 miles on. One fuel pump, 2 clutches, 3 sets of tires, some other odds and ends, and still going. Easy to fix and lots of leg room and about the same size as my I3. An indy can work on it. One trip to BMW and its all under water.

 

[Mondomensch]

Shop with an eye towards what is practical for you. Don't try to make what others have as practical to fit you. For instance. You mentioned leg room. I have a mini cooper that I have put almost 200,000 miles on. One fuel pump, 2 clutches, 3 sets of tires, some other odds and ends, and still going. Easy to fix and lots of leg room and about the same size as my I3. An indy can work on it. One trip to BMW and its all under water.

Yes. ...(edited to remove wrong info)

 

[alohart]

Yes. I believe the i3 is actually based on the same platform as the Mini Clubman, interestingly.

That's probably overstating their similarities. Some Mini electrics do use the i3's propulsion motor and maybe motor electronics and transaxle. But I think that's about it. Even though some Mini battery packs are a similar capacity to the 94 Ah i3, the battery packs are different.

Sharing a platform usually means sharing the entire rolling skateboard chassis which definitely isn't true for the i3 and any Mini electric.