Buyer's Remorse - Range Disappointments Continue

[lencap]

Greetings -

I've owned my BEV i3 for less than a month, and have posted about mileage shortfall in prior posts. I've tried lots of things, including various BMW drive modes, varying my driving style, staying "dead center" on the GOM gauge, and many other tricks. The bottom line is that the mileage continues to disappoint, and as the weather turns colder is getting worse.

I realize that cold weather drops range, but the magnitude of the drop is surprisingly large. In my Prius experience cold weather dropped range by 10%. On the Leaf the range drop was a bit more, but still less than 15% from warm weather driving. On the i3 the drop is 25% - very large versus my expectations.

With a daily range of 60 miles (and it's not even winter yet) the car is borderline useful for me. A 60 mile range is realistically a 25-30 radius from my home. That's fine for work commuting, but useless for weekend driving. I have a Clipper Creek charger installed in my garage (a very good unit and fine value), but when running weekend errands I find it very challenging to get my tasks done within the mileage restrictions.

I've tried unsuccessfully to get suggestions from BMW, but they have been remarkably unhelpful. Not a single call back after repeated requests for guidance. It seems that BMW is trying to avoid any comment about range. The dealership has also tried to get a response, and has been similarly ignored.

So now I'm becoming frustrated and resentful. If BMW had provided accurate information about the vastly decreased cold weather range I could have opted for a Rex version of the car, or determined that the car didn't meet my needs and waited for a greater range version of the car. Unfortunately neither option is available now. I'm stuck with a car that is marginally useful and I have no options. That's not what I expected and very frustrating after having purchased 7 BMW cars and 3 BMW motorcycles in the last 20 years.

I still love the car, but with a severely limited range I feel deceived and unhappy. Did BMW lie to me? No, not in the strictest sense of the term, but failing to disclose the 25% drop in winter range is significant and should have been disclosed more fully.

Caveat Emptor!

 

[i3atl]

Have you tried scheduling a time for preconditioning either in the car or via the app? Assuming you have the heated seats option, this will warm the battery and should make a significant difference in the potential range.

According to the discussion in the Facebook group, preconditioning "on demand" via the app only conditions the cabin, not the battery, and won't help with range.

On another note, I agree that the i3 seems to be more affected by winter temps than the Leaf was.

 

[lencap]

Thanks for the reply. Yes, I have tried preconditioning, but the range problem still remains.

I didn't realize that the app preconditions differently. I'll retry, just to be sure.

It seems strange that the i3 is more affected by the cold, especially since the Leaf battery pack isn't thermally controlled.

Thanks for the tip.

 

[I33t]

Is it possible there is a problem with your specific car?

It sounds like your dealer is supportive, I wonder if they would swap a demo BEV for a few days to see if it is a general problem for you or a specific problem with your car?

 

[jelloslug]

I have a Leaf and an i3 and I can say the biggest difference between the two in cold weather is the number on the GoM. The actual usable range drop is about the same if you do not precondition the i3 and is less than the Leaf if you do. The number on the dash is almost useless as it's constantly changing. This is why people are demanding a real state of charge percentage on the dash BTW. Many times on a cold morning in the Leaf it will say 98 miles on a full charge and by the time I reach the end of my subdivision it will have dropped by 20 miles or so.

 

[MikeS]

I also saw a significant dip in my range and that was before the cold weather. And its not really cold in southern UK, 0 deg C for a few days but averaging 8 deg C now so hard to blame the weather. My car started to give less than 60 mile range on a full charge and as I have a REX I can see the SOC % so I can see the stats are correct. My dealer took the car in and I believe they changed the KLE as instructed by BMW. As many have commented elsewhere on this forum I’ve no idea why the KLE should affect the range but its now around 75 miles and although the predicted range in ECO Pro and ECO PRO + shows more (80 to 85 ish) in reality I still only get around 75. I assume this is because even if you drive in comfort mode its the driving style that has the greatest affect on the range.

However, this still does not match either BMW’s statement that 'And it boasts an impressive real-world range of up to 100 miles” or the statement that 'The BMW i3's official range is 80 to 100 miles under the New European Driving Cycle (NEDC), and up to 120 miles in the most efficient driving mode.’

I bought my car in Sept when it was still warm and never saw anything in excess of 80mile range.

I intend to monitor its performance over the next 6 months or so and if there is no significant improvement they can have it back! Pity really, as otherwise its a fantastic car.

 

[BrianStanier]

HOn another note, I agree that the i3 seems to be more affected by winter temps than the Leaf was.

I don't think I see any significant difference even though we use heating now all the time (because we have Rex). The i3's aerodynamics are worse than the Leaf's, so cold, denser air should affect it more especially if you do much higher speed driving.

 

[DAZ]

:shock: I've had my Prius Plug In for two years and my i3 for three months. I've learned, whatever the projected EV range is, it's still not enough. Going from my Prius Plug In with a projected 10 miles EV, to my i3 BEV is heaven. Before, I could barely make my 9.6 mile one way commute on a charge, and then required charging at work to drive EV home. With my i3, I can normally make my roundtrip work commute three times on a charge. I have Level 2 charging at work and haven't used it once in three months. My i3 BEVs range is manageable for my lifestyle and I wouldn't benefit from a REx, but more EV rage would be welcomed.

With my Prius Plug In experience over two winters, EVs to include my i3, suffer from a reduction in range in the cooler, winter months. Thats the downside. Once it starts to warm up, you'll be pleasantly surprised with increased EV range that's normal.

 

[elptex]

I'm in the southeast UK and so far we've driven quite a few days <6C/42F and a a dozen or so <0C/32F. I am experiencing range down to 70-75 miles per charge; in warmer weather (generally >10C/50F), we were getting 80-90. There are so many factors to maximizing range that I stay very mindful of. One of the keys is that I only go 60mph on the highway. I set the cruise and remind myself that the difference of 60mph and 70mph over my highway distance (14 miles) is a mere 1 minute and 30 seconds--big whoop. The other measure is that by going 60mph I am gaining 3-4 miles of range--that is a lot more valuable to me than 90 seconds.

Preconditioning is another huge factor. Setting a departure time means it will 1) condition the battery (bring it up to optimal operating temperature and 2) warm the cabin. As noted above, hitting "Precondition" on the app only does the cabin and does not put any prep to the battery itself. When the battery is preconditioned, I get mileage not dissimilar to warmer outside temperatures. It makes a HUGE difference. I am able to see that difference every single day: I can precondition the battery at home but not at work, so my trip to work gets amazing efficiency while the trip home gets 10-15% less efficiency. Specifically, I will use about 40% charge to get to work while I will use 55% charge to get home. If you aren't using departure times for preconditioning, you are missing out big time.

I believe BMW should be doing more: they built an incredible product and are letting it down by not having enough information readily available. On the other hand, anyone buying an electric car right now is an 'innovator' on the technology adoption cycle. The "problem" with a car is that, as a function, cars are not new technology--they are an integral part of humanity at this point in history. As such, people don't treat something like an EV as a wholly new technology and all the careful consideration associated with new technology. The problem arises where in other areas of technology advancement, 'innovators' are independently driven forward and do not rely on outside input to press forward. Combine the expected of what cars should deliver with the new technology of EV and there are many people who are not of the mindset and approach of being an 'innovator'. BMW (and Nissan and every other manufacturer making EVs) has not approach selling their EVs under this consideration. Me? I spent countless hundreds of hours scouring the internet learning everything I possibly could about EVs, which led me to reading about battery technology and electric motors; I digested as many blogs as I could from the pioneers who had EVs in the 90's and people who had converted their ICE's to EV's. I thoroughly read every page of the i3 manual before I bought it to ensure I knew as much as possible about the workings of it--mechanical and software. Why? Because I have a 74 miles daily commute and my transportation has to be reliable.

BMW (and other EV manufacturers) should do more to educate people, while individuals should also take responsibility to ensure they know exactly what they are getting into. You are doing the right thing by seeking out answers and solutions online; hopefully the preconditioning knowledge will help.

Tech adoption cycle reference image: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/45/DiffusionOfInnovation.png

 

[MikeS]

elptex = Im in SE England as well (near Brighton), but even when I drive in eco pro+ and never exceed 50 mph I don’t see more than 75 mile range. The last 2 days the temp was around 8 deg C and still only got 74 miles!

Useful info about preconditioning via car or app. Not sure if there would be any real benefit unless the car was on charge, particularly if the journeys are very short.

 

[elptex]

elptex = Im in SE England as well (near Brighton), but even when I drive in eco pro+ and never exceed 50 mph I don’t see more than 75 mile range. The last 2 days the temp was around 8 deg C and still only got 74 miles!

Same, in this weather. In September/October we were getting 80+ miles, of which 26 would be going 60mph on the motorway.

 

[websterize]

Tyler Harris posted this document on the i3 Facebook page. Fairly sure it's a BMW document, perhaps for dealer training? Check out the electric-only data.

 

[BMW4Me]

...The i3's aerodynamics are worse than the Leaf's...

Not sure that .29 vs .28 qualifies as "worse" so I wouldn't attribute reduced range to aerodynamics.

It's helpful to know that battery conditioning only works with scheduled, not on demand, preconditioning.

I think that even if not plugged in, it makes sense to use either preconditioning method so long as the vehicle is inside and at higher temperature than outside.

[corrected to properly attribute quote]

 

[i3MK]

Tyler Harris posted this document on the i3 Facebook page. Fairly sure it's a BMW document, perhaps for dealer training? Check out the electric-only data.

Have you /anyone here, seen anything similar for the BEV?

 

[i3atl]

Not sure that .29 vs .28 qualifies as "worse" so I wouldn't attribute reduced range to aerodynamics.

It's helpful to know that battery conditioning only works with scheduled, not on demand, preconditioning.

I think that even if not plugged in, it makes sense to use either preconditioning method so long as the vehicle is inside and at higher temperature than outside.

Just a note on your quote - I didn't write the bit about aero

 

[lencap]

I appreciate the many suggestions and helpful comments.

I've read and reread the various sections of the owner's manual about charging and climate control, but I'm not certain that I fully understand the process. Maybe that's part of the problem.

For example, I set my car control to a 7:15AM departure time for Monday through Friday. My internal temperature control is set to 68. I also set the automatic climate control to activate at the departure time of 7:15 AM.

My car is connected to my home charger - Clipper Creek HSC 40 direct wired - and what puzzles me is that right now - 9:45 PM - the car's climate control is apparently on, I can hear the noises from under the hood, and the interior of the car is warming. I also see the climate control fan symbol flashing. Finally, I set the car's control to not charge immediately, but to charge during off peak time - which I defined at 4:00AM to 8:00 AM.

My expectation is that with the settings I've described the car will begin charging tomorrow morning at 4:00AM and will be fully charged (currently about 70% charged) with the car's climate control bringing the interior temperature to 68, and with the car's battery pack preconditioned to the best operating temperature for the car. My car is parked in the garage, about 50 degrees with outside temperature in the low 40s.

My question is: Why is the climate control on now? The climate control is set for a 7:15AM departure, and the car is set to charge during low peak time - starting at 4AM. The climate control is working, the car warming, but it seems that the warmup is premature given my departure setting.

What am I doing wrong, or is what I described normal?

By the way, the owners manual is very poorly written. Pages 128-129 describing this process is hard to fully understand and no detailed explanation is provided. Pages 160-161 are equally vague. The lack of clarity from the manual's instructions, at least for me, may be contributing to my frustration at properly setting the controls to achieve optimal mileage by preconditioning the car correctly.

All I want is to get the car to provide the best range possible in all conditions. I really like the car, and I'd like to know the best procedures for getting the most out of the car. I find it hard to believe that with the high quality battery packs that BMW provides the car is incapable of besting the driving range of the Nissan Leaf in colder weather, especially since the Leaf battery pack isn't thermally adjusted while the BMW is.

I believe that the key to extending range is to better understand the BMW process, or for BMW to rewrite some of the software associated with battery preconditioning. If this can be solved I'd be a happy camper. Until then the frustration continues to mount.

Any thoughts are welcome.

 

[i3MK]

I believe that the key to extending range is to better understand the BMW process, or for BMW to rewrite some of the software associated with battery preconditioning. If this can be solved I'd be a happy camper. Until then the frustration continues to mount.

Any thoughts are welcome.

Have you emailed [email protected]

 

[Jeffj]

Lencap, have you looked at the hidden service menu to see what you actual battery capacity is? There is an option in there that tells you the capacity that your car is operating on. Here is a quick recap of how to get it (pulled from a file on the facebook page):

You'll want to look at option 13.08

If you capacity is below 18 kWh, then that explains a lot of your range issues. If you capacity is above 19, then there is something else going on. I believe 18.8 (don't quote me on that number) is the "nominal" number. There is a cutoff in the 17's that seemes to be the bottom of the range for a new car. I also understand that this is the metric that is used to determine whether your battery is still within the warranted capacity at the end of 8 years (70% of 18.8).

____________________________________________________

To enter the menu, hold down the trip meter button on the side of the instrument cluster screen for 10 seconds. From then on, pressing this button means "next" and holding down the button means "select".

To begin with you have only these options available:

1 Identification
1.01 Conv. Index (1/mls)
1.02 SWFL 1
1.03 VIN
1.04 HMI Version
2 System test
3 Start roller
10 Unlock

To unlock the following menus, you will need the VIN from 1.03 above. Add the last FOUR digits together (other BMW models require adding the last five digits) to get your unlock code. e.g if your VIN is L12345, your code is 2+3+4+5=14. If that doesn't work, try adding the last five digits.

11 Consumption
11.01 Consumption dist. (l/km)
11.02 Consumption time (l/h)

12 Range
12.01 Range consumption (l/100km)
12.02 Range (km)

13 Fuel Tank/Battery
13.01 tank left (ohm)
13.02 tank right
13.03 tank left (litres) - zero
13.04 tank right 7.9l
13.05 tank total
13.07 display value
13.07 tank phase. 1
13.08 Batt. Kapa. Max. 19.8 kWh (maximum designed battery capacity)
13.09 State of charge
13.10 Batt. Ladung (battery charge)
13.11 Batt. Anziege (battery meter indication)

14.01 O. Temp. Sensor
14.02 O. Temp. Raw data
14.03 coolant temp
14.04 oil temp
14.05 batterietemp

15.01 litre counter
15.02 time counter
15.03 distance counter
15.04 kWh-Zaehler ("kWh counter")

16.01 v CAN (km/h)
16.02 v Display (km/h)
16.03 Cruise Control (km/h)
16.04 Rev. Counter (1/min)

17 System Voltage
17.01 Ubatt (V)

18 Accoustics
19 DTC
20 Dimming LCD
20.01 LCD temp. Sensor (ADC)
20.02 LCD temperature (C)
20.03 Light sensor
20.04 LCD luminance

21 Dimming PWM
21.01 Dimming wheel
21.02 Display
21.03 Scales/pt. orange
21.04 Underfloor pointer
21.05 Status lights
21.06 Status lights blue

22 CBS (condition based service)
22.01 km/year short term (km)
22.02 service call status
22.03 Limit, time (Month)
22.04 Limit, distance (km)

23 Check
24 Correct. Factor (careful!)
25 software reset

 

[Marki3]

I believe that the key to extending range is to better understand the BMW process, or for BMW to rewrite some of the software associated with battery preconditioning. If this can be solved I'd be a happy camper. Until then the frustration continues to mount.


I am also a bit disappointed in the marked range drop. I have a 62 mile round trip to work and the range drop in winter is making that pretty much impossible. I must say that if the sales person had shown me the document of predicted range in unfavorable conditions, I would have chosen a lease with 12000 miles rather than 15000. I am looking at 3-4 months of weather in which I cannot use the car to commute. I have preconditioned every trip and can just get to work and back if I use no heating, eco mode and have no unexpected delays. Not really how I want to travel in winter! On the same round trip in summer I was getting an easy 80-85 miles. This is coming off the charger first thing after doing my commute the day before.

 

[websterize]

As a fellow BEVer on the U.S. East Coast. I empathize with your range frustration. In ~40ºF weather, a 60 mile-max. range estimate at moderate average speed (~45 mph) is not normal. Maybe in <20ºF air. Maybe at sustained >70mph speeds. You could have a faulty high-voltage module, but I doubt it.

I suspect, despite your efforts to precondition the cabin and HV battery, the cells are not at an efficient temperature when you set off. The car is probably using parasitic energy to heat them. That’ll easily eat up 5-10 miles.

The car should not have been heating the cabin at 9:45 p.m. Something is screwy with your timer configuration. To troubleshoot, I would start with the basics: check that your car’s clock is accurate, that there isn’t a fault with your L2, and I’d turn off the off-peak charging setting. Set up a random time over the holiday break when you’re awake and can see what it’s doing after it's been sitting a few hours. If all that fails, schedule a service appointment. Sorry, that's all I got.

Just a side note: those segmented range-bars are an estimate. Next time you’re driving, turn the temperature dial to max heat, and watch what happens to the range figure in the instrument cluster. One of the i3 elders on the Facebook page compared the accuracy of the range bars to the accuracy of a sundial for telling time, and a % state-of-charge indicator to a digital watch. That’s just the perfect analogy.

We should get a HV battery % SOC indicator as a Board Computer option in the spring. (Some are already testing it.) I’ll have my BC set to that for a truer range estimate.