BMW i3 Battery Upgrade Program

[TomMoloughney]

BMW recently announced a battery upgrade (retrofit) program. However BMW AG is leaving it up to individual markets if they want to participate. Both BMW of North America and BMW UK declined to participate at this time. Personally I think they made the right decision, for now. Here's my reasoning:

http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/2016/05/heres-why-i3-battery-upgrade-currently.html

 

[alohart]

I agree with your analysis. However, in the BMW press release is stated "BMW gives BMW i customers the opportunity of retrofitting their purely electric BMW i3 (60 Ah) with the new 33 kWh battery" (emphasis mine). To me, that would exclude REx models because they are not purely electric. Is that your interpretation? I see no reason why REx models would be excluded, so maybe I'm misinterpreting the press release.

 

[TomMoloughney]

I agree with your analysis. However, in the BMW press release is stated "BMW gives BMW i customers the opportunity of retrofitting their purely electric BMW i3 (60 Ah) with the new 33 kWh battery" (emphasis mine). To me, that would exclude REx models because they are not purely electric. Is that your interpretation? I see no reason why REx models would be excluded, so maybe I'm misinterpreting the press release.

I noticed that also. It's difficult to say exactly what they mean. What I can say is they may be limiting it to current BEV owners because REx owners really have no need for it - yet. I absolutely believe it will eventually be available to all i3 owners, once the program expands.

Right now, the only market we know for sure it's available in is Germany. The BMW divisions is other countries may all on it for now since it's just not something that makes sense financially until the batteries get a little older and degrade a bit more.

If someone has a one or two year old i3 and needs to spend $8,000 to upgrade the battery already they probably bought the wrong car, IMO. They would be much better served just trading it in an a new i3 with the improved battery cells.

 

[epirali]

BMW recently announced a battery upgrade (retrofit) program. However BMW AG is leaving it up to individual markets if they want to participate. Both BMW of North America and BMW UK declined to participate at this time. Personally I think they made the right decision, for now. Here's my reasoning:

http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/2016/05/heres-why-i3-battery-upgrade-currently.html

Great analysis. The only three thoughts I have to add:

1) At $8,000 depending on the state you live in and what kind of trade in you get from BMW for lease/purchase even the pure economics of the battery upgrade becomes a bit questionable.

2) Are there ANY mechanical or technical differences in the REX that would make a battery swap more difficult? I am not very familiar with the layout of the i3, but I am wondering if that may be part of the reason they are not offering it to REX owners just yet?

3) The Roadster upgrade was a strange bird. As an owner I kept thinking about why would I do that. I can't possibly drive that car for that many hours for the extended range, and if its for "track use" I am constantly battling heat issues with motor/PMU way before I drain the battery. Even if you want to burn that kind of money I still can't come up with a single thing you gain except spec wars.

 

[janner]

The ReX is purely electric. It isn't purely battery.

 

[TomMoloughney]

BMW recently announced a battery upgrade (retrofit) program. However BMW AG is leaving it up to individual markets if they want to participate. Both BMW of North America and BMW UK declined to participate at this time. Personally I think they made the right decision, for now. Here's my reasoning:

http://bmwi3.blogspot.com/2016/05/heres-why-i3-battery-upgrade-currently.html

Great analysis. The only three thoughts I have to add:

1) At $8,000 depending on the state you live in and what kind of trade in you get from BMW for lease/purchase even the pure economics of the battery upgrade becomes a bit questionable.

2) Are there ANY mechanical or technical differences in the REX that would make a battery swap more difficult? I am not very familiar with the layout of the i3, but I am wondering if that may be part of the reason they are not offering it to REX owners just yet?

3) The Roadster upgrade was a strange bird. As an owner I kept thinking about why would I do that. I can't possibly drive that car for that many hours for the extended range, and if its for "track use" I am constantly battling heat issues with motor/PMU way before I drain the battery. Even if you want to burn that kind of money I still can't come up with a single thing you gain except spec wars.

I bet you'd have preferred to get Supercharger access rather than the 29K battery upgrade offered, right?

 

[epirali]

I bet you'd have preferred to get Supercharger access rather than the 29K battery upgrade offered, right?

Kick me while I'm down why don't you!

The worse part is I'd even pay a fee, but there is no adapter. And the Roadster can supposedly handle a pretty good rate of charge.

Now about driving across the country in a Roadster...I have done it in an MR2 Spyder, but the suspension was so much more accommodating....

 

[alohart]

The ReX is purely electric. It isn't purely battery.

Then all i3's are "purely electric", so there would have been no need for BMW to have included "purely electric" as an "i3" modifier.

We're all just guessing about this at the moment. We might need to learn whether German REx's are included in BMW's battery swap program to know for certain because that's apparently the only market where the battery swap program will be implemented initially.

 

[PhilH]

Struck me as marketing speak: emphasising how advanced the i3 is.

 

[janner]

All i3s are Purely Electric but the BMW (parallel) hybrids aren't.

 

[i3Alan]

The ReX is purely electric. It isn't purely battery.

No, it is not. Purely means entirely. Granted, the wheels of both the REX and BEV are directly driven purely by the electric motor. However, the gasoline engine in the REX means that the vehicle, as a whole, is not powered entirely by electricity, but by a (serial) hybrid system.

 

[jadnashuanh]

The ReX is purely electric. It isn't purely battery.

No, it is not. Purely means entirely. Granted, the wheels of both the REX and BEV are directly driven purely by the electric motor. However, the gasoline engine in the REX means that the vehicle, as a whole, is not powered entirely by electricity, but by a (serial) hybrid system.

Semantics...the only thing that drives an i3 is the electric motor. WHere it gets its energy from will depend, but it is purely electrically driven. Unlike most other hybrids where there is a mechanical connection to the drive wheels that can allow either or both the electric motor and ICE to propel the car.

 

[i3Alan]

The ReX is purely electric. It isn't purely battery.

No, it is not. Purely means entirely. Granted, the wheels of both the REX and BEV are directly driven purely by the electric motor. However, the gasoline engine in the REX means that the vehicle, as a whole, is not powered entirely by electricity, but by a (serial) hybrid system.

Semantics...the only thing that drives an i3 is the electric motor. WHere it gets its energy from will depend, but it is purely electrically driven. Unlike most other hybrids where there is a mechanical connection to the drive wheels that can allow either or both the electric motor and ICE to propel the car.

Not semantics. Accuracy. The REX is NOT PURELY electric. It has ICE parts, which is why the REX is not a BEV.

If you want to separate the REX into the electrical parts and the ICE parts and say the ICE parts do not count as useful parts of the REX, then yes, the REX without the ICE parts is PURELY electric. Just don't forget to say WITHOUT THE ICE STUFF when you say the REX without the ICE stuff is ENTIRELY electric.

You can't just draw a line between the genset and the battery and say because that line can be drawn so the REX is entirely electric, because that line is still separating parts of the REX that are parts of the REX that are used to help propel the REX down the road, whether or not that help is on one side of the line or not. That line is ENTIRELY inside the REX.

Yes, the motive force to the wheels comes entirely from an electric motor, but that is NOT the ENTIRETY of a REX. So a REX is not ENTIRELY electric. Now, you are free to say the REX electric motor is entirely electric. Or, the REX battery is entirely electric. But, the REX is not ENTIRELY electric. Unless you want to play semantic games that are illogical.

 

[I33t]

The i3 REX motion is electrically driven, but the power to drive that motion is not 100% electric.

Few people would claim that a REX is a 100% electric car.

It's like saying that beer is 100% hops. There is just more to it than just one part of the equation.

 

[TOEd]

I am too weak to resist contributing to this off topic (hijacked) thread! IMHO the i3 with REx option can be either a BEV or an ICE depending on how it is driven. Some people have said that they shouldn't have bought the option because they rarely, if ever, will use it. So by my definition this is still a BEV because it runs only on battery power. Others can theoretically run it soley on gasoline with the ICE. Although still a hybrid, these people are essentially driving a very efficient ICE car. Neither use is bad in my opinion. So I prefer to save my criticism for those cheating VW diesels and gas guzzlers. Oh, and thread hijackers like me! ☺

 

[jadnashuanh]

40mpg or so when running on the REx is not, IMHO, super efficient! Yes, it's better than many cars out there, and when the battery is fully charged it's close to being the most efficient car on the road, but run only with the REx providing electricity...not close to the most efficient cars out there! Throw in the 9l tank, and not very convenient, either. NOt too bad if you can find CCS units, but a pain if relying on fuel stations only.

 

[TOEd]

I agree that the 7 litre fuel tank is a pain on long trips. You only need to read the thread "Emergency fuel supply in frunk" to see just how inconvenient it can be.

 

[i3Alan]

I am too weak to resist contributing to this off topic (hijacked) thread! IMHO the i3 with REx option can be either a BEV or an ICE depending on how it is driven. Some people have said that they shouldn't have bought the option because they rarely, if ever, will use it. So by my definition this is still a BEV because it runs only on battery power. Others can theoretically run it soley on gasoline with the ICE. Although still a hybrid, these people are essentially driving a very efficient ICE car. Neither use is bad in my opinion. So I prefer to save my criticism for those cheating VW diesels and gas guzzlers. Oh, and thread hijackers like me! ☺

Yes, you can operate a REX like a BEV. It still has the potential to operate with the REX. Driving a car down hill in neutral with the engine off does not mean it is a soap box derby cart during that ride down the hill. Even if that down hill ride is 100 miles long. How a REX is operated does not change what it is, and it is NOT a BEV, even during the times it is operated in pure electric mode. Even if the REX is only ever operated for maintenance cycles. Physically remove the ICE genset out of the REX, and then it is a BEV. What it is is not a function of how it is used. How it is used is dependent on what it is.

 

[imkazaam]

I know I'm late. I agree with janner. The REX is an electric car. The type of motor that drives the car, i.e., the motor that moves it, 100% of the time, determines the type of car it is.

Therefore the REX is an electric car. It does, however, have a range extending motor which runs off of gasoline. This does not make it a hybrid, however, as the REX has nothing to do with the i3 drivetrain.

It is simply a backup power source to keep the batteries charged. There are hybrids that can run temporarily off of their electric motors, but the REX runs off of its electric motor 100% of the time. It uses the REX to charge the batteries, therefore it is an electric car.

I disagree with the adjective 'purely,' but I wouldn't call it a 'hybrid' electric car. Though if you wanted to be extremely precise, you could distinguish between:

gas (engine) driven cars
gas driven, electric supported cars ... aka hybrids
electric driven cars
electric driven, gas supported cars ... aka REX

Without speaking about anything other than what form of motor drives the car, you cannot define what it is.

 

[psquare]

93% of our journeys are electric.

18 months in, we're at 26k+ miles and counting.

Meanwhile, people on here discuss whether a REx is an EV or not.

I couldn't care less.