Air conditioning failed

[jadnashuanh]

The a/c system not only cools the cabin, it also cools the batteries, so if the compressor destroys itself and gets metal bits in the lines, it is a major issue to remove all of them (often by replacing parts, but getting to them is part of the issue).

So, probably only BMW has the real stats on this, while it can happen, doesn't seem to be a major problem. IF it does, it's expensive to repair. I suppose they could have made the two systems separate, but that would also mean more weight. Everything is a tradeoff.

FWIW, not all a/c fails would throw metal particles into the system, and usually (not always) that would be preceded by some funky noises or loss of performance that, especially in this case, should not be ignored! Even in the wintertime, to dry the air, the a/c system can run, so you'd notice it then, as well as in the summer.

 

[i3Alan]

Couple of issues.

1) Most auto AC systems have traps in the dryer to catch non-refrigerant particles that aren't supposed to be there. Apparently, BMW chose to leave the trap out, trading off slightly higher AC efficiency for robustness of the system. I am guessing that the i3 Rex would likely be slightly less expensive to repair than the BEV because it only has 1 heat pump loop and 1 regular AC loop, rather than 2 heat pumps, so there would be a few less parts involved.

2) It appears that the catastrophic AC compressor failure which takes down both the cabin and battery heat pumps in the process is rare, and the only cases I have heard about are in i3s that are at least 4 years old. I have not yet seen any reports on 2016 or later model years, but have seen reports on 2014 and 2015 model i3s.

3) Last I heard, BMW started covering all but about $5K of this >$20K repair. I don't know if that is their new policy on this issue, but I do know it is not retroactive, as all I got was a $2000 "goodwill" check that did not even cover 10% of the cost. To cover my actual losses, BMW owes me $7838.62, accounting for what I loss in trade-in value on my i3. I presented BMW with an documented itemized claim for this amount, which was denied.

 

[panamamike]

....

3) Last I heard, BMW started covering all but about $5K of this >$20K repair. I don't know if that is their new policy on this issue, but I do know it is not retroactive, as all I got was a $2000 "goodwill" check that did not even cover 10% of the cost. To cover my actual losses, BMW owes me $7838.62, accounting for what I loss in trade-in value on my i3. I presented BMW with an documented itemized claim for this amount, which was denied.

How did you learn of this new policy? Is there a link?

 

[i3Alan]

....

3) Last I heard, BMW started covering all but about $5K of this >$20K repair. I don't know if that is their new policy on this issue, but I do know it is not retroactive, as all I got was a $2000 "goodwill" check that did not even cover 10% of the cost. To cover my actual losses, BMW owes me $7838.62, accounting for what I loss in trade-in value on my i3. I presented BMW with an documented itemized claim for this amount, which was denied.

How did you learn of this new policy? Is there a link?

I have read two i3 owners say that BMW paid for all but what would have been the cost of just an AC compressor replacement. One was somewhere here on myBMWi3.com, and one was on the Facebook i3 group page. There were enough differences that I am pretty sure these were different individuals. Others have suggested that BMW tries to follow consistent policy on such things, and it made sense that 1) they should try to establish a policy, and 2) any such policy will take time to formulate after the first few cases materialize. However, the idea that BMW has an official policy is only an assumption on my part. I hope they do, as that would be good. I would also hope this would be retroactive, as such actions usually are (as is typical when companies offer to refund costs paid for things that are later covered in a service bulletin).

It has been about 8 months since my catastrophic BMW failure, but no such reach-back from BMW to me has yet occured. I am only asking for about half of what they are paying for repairs in their assumed new policy in order to make me whole.

 

[jlangham]

Update. Two weeks later and the AC went out again. This time making clicking noises (in the rear, where the compressor is located). Dealer said the compressor self-destructed, throwing metal fillings throughout the refrigerant lines, requiring all of the AC components to be replaced.

Total repair estimate was over $21,000. TWENTY-ONE THOUSAND DOLLARS.

In a good will gesture, BMW will contribute $2000 towards the purchase of a new BMW, with the dealer kicking in $4000 as a trade-in (for a totaled car!).

I think I'll pass. On BMW. Forevermore.

Anyone interested in salvaging a 2014 Giga BEV i3 in Tempe, Arizona?

Same thing with my AC. Same quote from, possibly, the same dealer service department. Had to pay $542 just to pick up my car and they did a semi-car wash. I think this is their standard quote for any AC failure. They didn't offer me anything on a new car trade in, so maybe mine's worse?

 

[i3Alan]

Same thing with my AC. Same quote from, possibly, the same dealer service department. Had to pay $542 just to pick up my car and they did a semi-car wash. I think this is their standard quote for any AC failure. They didn't offer me anything on a new car trade in, so maybe mine's worse?

Forgot to mention, if you wait 30 days, Chapman BMW will send you a coupon for 10% off the service quote should you decide to go ahead with the repair! :mrgreen:

 

[ronin]

And sell your personal information to Sirus XM so you get junk mail, spam and robocalls for 3 years.

 

[BenPrice]

Just adding myself to the rolls of those who have had the air conditioning fail on their 2014 i3 Rex. Car is still under CPO warranty until June 2021.

I took it in back in July here in Denver, because, at 56,000 miles, the AC started working only intermittently. I told them I had to keep it set on 60 degrees and control it manually to get it to work. They returned it to me with a note, "System working, unable to replicate symptom."

I returned it to the shop last week. After a few days, got a video by email from the technician - compressor has failed, threw metal filings throughout the system, needs to be replaced. The shop called me shortly thereafter, said it needs between $10k-14k worth of work, they will have to get approval from BMW NA, because all the AC lines, the compressor, and the condenser would need to be replaced (as described in other's posts on this thread). I told them I had read these threads, was alarmed at all that would have to be done and what the cost would be, so to please let me know as soon as they got word back from corporate. They said it could take a while to hear back from corporate, then 8-15 days to order the extensive list of parts required, then time for the labor.

That was Friday, this is Tuesday. I got a text this afternoon stating that my car was ready, and they emailed the invoice. All the work was covered under warranty, but they replaced only the compressor and 3 gaskets, with the following notes: "Metal in lines, created TSARA case, stated replace compressor and perform running in test plan. Replaced and performed required test plan. System now operating at high capacity and acts like normal. TSARA did not require for system to be flushed. Dryer filter will clear system and trap one contaminates."

I called BMW NA and was told they defer to the dealer. I called the dealer, and was told they defer to BMW NA's regional technician and can only do the work authorized by them. So I wasn't left with a choice, and I picked up the car last Wednesday.

The good news is, it's still under warranty until June of next year.

I guess we will see what happens in the coming days/months and I'll post an update. I don't feel confident that this isn't just going to happen again down the road.

 

[jlangham]

Well, at least your AC will be working again. Mine is dead. I am going to take it to another BMW shop that claims to have ONE factory trained tech for the i3. I can/will replace the compressor ($1800 from BMW) and let them do the flush and work. Hope it's around $3-4k total. It's worth it for Phoenix heat to have the AC working.

Keep us up to date on how yours is coming.

 

[alohart]

It's worth it for Phoenix heat to have the AC working.

Because the A/C cools the battery pack, the output power of the battery pack would almost certainly be limited due to overheating due to a non-functional compressor. This would significantly limit the maximum power of the propulsion motor.

 

[flyboy320]

Because the A/C cools the battery pack, the output power of the battery pack would almost certainly be limited due to overheating due to a non-functional compressor. This would significantly limit the maximum power of the propulsion motor.

I could be wrong, but I thought the battery is only actively cooled when it's been charged, and only then if needed, ie., gets above a set temperature threshold, it's NOT cooled when your driving the car.

 

[jlangham]

It's worth it for Phoenix heat to have the AC working.

Because the A/C cools the battery pack, the output power of the battery pack would almost certainly be limited due to overheating due to a non-functional compressor. This would significantly limit the maximum power of the propulsion motor.

That is exactly the case. Here in Phoenix area, especially in the summer with no air conditioning, you can tell the difference. I'm glad it does manage it for me because I'm not always mindful of it, especially in heavy traffic where I need to "zip" around.

I hope to get my compressor fixed soon by a local shop with a factory trained tech. The car just doesn't run as good without it.

Plus, when I come home in the middle of the afternoon and it's 115 outside, when I plug in the charger at home, the yellow light comes on and never get blue. I know it's because of the temperature of the battery because of no cooling. Later in the evening, I just go out in the garage and just open and close my door, and it car retries the charging and begins to charge because the battery has cooled off enough.

I've stopped driving my car because I don't want to further degrade my battery pack. It's a 2014 BEV with 75k miles and would like to make it last as long as possible.

 

[JeremyStephen]

Hi! I've been following this discussion as I've been having an issue where my AC stops cooling intermittently! I also noticed that the Coolant Temp is constantly at +118C, while Battery Temp is +29C.....is that normal?
When the heat is less, it cools really cold....but again will shut cooling off suddenly & come back on briefly....when it's really hot, it really takes awhile to bring the temperature down.
I've been concerned as I know the battery temp is also managed through the AC system!
Also noticed that it seems like the cooling is reactivated (compressor comes on?) when I accelerate hard! Now I heard that the i3 AC runs on an independent motor, unlike usual belt driven, so that seems not possible.....
Will a replacement of the Pressure/Temp sensor 2(as done above) solve it?
Any thoughts or advice please?

 

[eXodus]

Hi! I've been following this discussion as I've been having an issue where my AC stops cooling intermittently! I also noticed that the Coolant Temp is constantly at +118C, while Battery Temp is +29C.....is that normal?
When the heat is less, it cools really cold....but again will shut cooling off suddenly & come back on briefly....when it's really hot, it really takes awhile to bring the temperature down.
I've been concerned as I know the battery temp is also managed through the AC system!
Also noticed that it seems like the cooling is reactivated (compressor comes on?) when I accelerate hard! Now I heard that the i3 AC runs on an independent motor, unlike usual belt driven, so that seems not possible.....
Will a replacement of the Pressure/Temp sensor 2(as done above) solve it?
Any thoughts or advice please?

Where are you reading the coolant temp? Are you driving in EcoPro? that makes the A/C cut in and out.
In Comfort the A/C is more steady. Here in sunny and hot Florida - during the middle of the Day I always drive in Comfort - otherwise the A/C is not doing it's job.

 

[JeremyStephen]

sorry

 

[JeremyStephen]

Hi! I've been following this discussion as I've been having an issue where my AC stops cooling intermittently! I also noticed that the Coolant Temp is constantly at +118C, while Battery Temp is +29C.....is that normal?
When the heat is less, it cools really cold....but again will shut cooling off suddenly & come back on briefly....when it's really hot, it really takes awhile to bring the temperature down.
I've been concerned as I know the battery temp is also managed through the AC system!
Also noticed that it seems like the cooling is reactivated (compressor comes on?) when I accelerate hard! Now I heard that the i3 AC runs on an independent motor, unlike usual belt driven, so that seems not possible.....
Will a replacement of the Pressure/Temp sensor 2(as done above) solve it?
Any thoughts or advice please?

Where are you reading the coolant temp? Are you driving in EcoPro? that makes the A/C cut in and out.
In Comfort the A/C is more steady. Here in sunny and hot Florida - during the middle of the Day I always drive in Comfort - otherwise the A/C is not doing it's job.

Okay, I'll try Comfort mode more often & see how it responds....Yes I drive mostly in Eco Pro, but it worked continuously without issue for about 4 months and I have tried switching to Comfort when the AC knocks off like I mentioned, with no effect! I even had the cabin filters changed & Freon pressure checked. But let me try Comfort throughout & see. I'm in Colombo, Sri Lanka & outside temperature is usually around 35C+ in the heat of the day.

BTW, on the highway (speed at least 70km/h) it works perfectly, even in Eco Pro!!!

The Coolant Temp, Battery Temp etc is found in the Menu of the display over the steering. They call it the 'secret menu' cos you've got to hold the button on the left for about 10 secs, then enter the sum of the last 5 digits of your VIN # as the code to access it....(it's all on YouTube ) I found it in my efforts to locate the Battery Capacity(Batt Kappa Max) before buying my present 2014 BEV

 

[alohart]

I prefer the more relaxed EcoPro mode power pedal response during the first half of its range but occasionally need full Comfort mode cabin cooling power. An iDrive setting allows one to have both by decoupling climate control from EcoPro mode. There's no reason for me to believe that this would solve the intermittent cabin cooling problem, but you could test driving in EcoPro mode with full climate control power.

Because climate control refrigerant cools the battery pack as well as the cabin, some have suggested that battery pack cooling is prioritized over cabin cooling. This might be obvious in hot weather as reduced cabin cooling, especially after driving hard or fast charging which would increase the battery pack temperature and thus cooling load.

The 118 ºC temperature reading in the service menu must be due to no temperature sensor for that particular reading. It's always 118 ºC on our 2014 BEV regardless of the ambient temperature, recent driving, etc. Just ignore it.

The climate control heat exchanger is behind the air intake below the front bumper. Leaves and other road trash can build up and block air flow to this heat exchanger and to the motor and motor electronics heat exchanger behind it. There's also a fan behind these heat exchangers. I assume that if the fan were non-functional, a warning message would be displayed, but I don't know that for a fact. It would be worth cleaning out any trash that's blocking air flow. I have installed a stainless steel wire mesh screen in the air intake to block this stuff, including stones that could damage the heat exchanger, from entering the air intake.

 

[JeremyStephen]

The climate control heat exchanger is behind the air intake below the front bumper. Leaves and other road trash can build up and block air flow to this heat exchanger and to the motor and motor electronics heat exchanger behind it. There's also a fan behind these heat exchangers. I assume that if the fan were non-functional, a warning message would be displayed, but I don't know that for a fact. It would be worth cleaning out any trash that's blocking air flow. I have installed a stainless steel wire mesh screen in the air intake to block this stuff, including stones that could damage the heat exchanger, from entering the air intake.

How do you access this air intake? take the storage box out?

 

[alohart]

How do you access this air intake? take the storage box out?

There is no access from above after removing the storage box because the air intake system includes a plastic duct that is open only in the front (grill) and the rear (heat exchanger).

Access is available from the front beneath the bumper through the grill. Some i3's have movable louvers just behind the grill that block access to the A/C heat exchanger when closed. Our 2014 BEV doesn't have these louvers, so I can see the heat exchanger through the grill. A local owner's 2019 BEV has these louvers. Other than model year, one difference between these BEV's is that ours doesn't have the seats and battery pack heating option. I don't know what needs to be done to force the louvers to open.

 

[JeremyStephen]

How do you access this air intake? take the storage box out?

There is no access from above after removing the storage box because the air intake system includes a plastic duct that is open only in the front (grill) and the rear (heat exchanger).

Access is available from the front beneath the bumper through the grill. Some i3's have movable louvers just behind the grill that block access to the A/C heat exchanger when closed. Our 2014 BEV doesn't have these louvers, so I can see the heat exchanger through the grill. A local owner's 2019 BEV has these louvers. Other than model year, one difference between these BEV's is that ours doesn't have the seats and battery pack heating option. I don't know what needs to be done to force the louvers to open.

Hey Art!
Thanks much for your invaluable info! Mine also doesn't have louvres. I can see the heat exchanger clearly (that's the one across the whole opening looking like the radiator, right?) but I can't seem to see the duct for the air intake....
I do remember tho, once when looking for the pressure/temp sensor, I noticed a plastic duct-like opening (approx 4"x3") under the storage box. Is that what I should be looking for, do you think?

I also discovered mouse droppings inside the storage box today! :shock: Got to deal with that too before the rodent gets to any wires or plastics! Guess that's 1 of the downsides of not having high heat parts as in an ICE!