No Level 2 (Fast charging) option on my I3?

[alohart]

"Std chrg" appears to be L1 related and this is centred around the standard 3 pin plug charging unit that comes with the car. This charges off the 230vac input supply. Nominal rating on domestic sockets is 13amp so it can pull about 3kw off such a charger. As a domestic socket can't announce its power to the car, the onus falls on the user to set the charging power level, "Max", "Reduced" or "Low". If the circuit has no other load, Max should be fine. If however the circuit has additional load or is being used with a lower power extension cable then Reduced or Low my be appropriate to avoid tripping breakers, blowing fuses or even worse, melting wire.

Is the standard charging cable that was supplied with the car just an electrical cable without any EVSE that can interact with the car to determine the charging current? If so, then the iDrive "Std chrg" setting would be the only thing that controls the charging current. With no EVSE functionality, the electrical pins of the charging cord plug would be at 230V as soon as the other end of the cord is plugged into the mains. This seems dangerous in wet conditions, so I must not be understanding what the standard charging cable is. If it is an EVSE, I don't understand how the car could distinguish between the standard charging cord ("Std chrg") and a wall box EVSE ("Fast chrg") since they both output the same voltage unlike in North America and implement the same charging protocol.

 

[user 3172]

Okay Art, slowly having a light bulb moment. I obviously wasn't thinking straight these last few days.

The L1 charger that comes with the car as standard has a 3 pin domestic plug on one end and the usual python plug on the other. I was thinking the plastic box they're wound around was nothing more than some switches, ground detectors and LED indicators but having re-read Brian's earlier post, it's clearly acting as an EVSE and putting out a pilot signal telling the car that it's attached to a normal household socket.

Brian's pilot signal post ....
Open - 6 A
1500 ohm - 13 A (stock L1 that comes with car)
680 ohm - 20 A (EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceCord 20, on order)
220 ohm - 32 A (L2 EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceBox Pro 40)
100 ohm - 63 A
50 ohm or < 100 ohm - 80 A

So, this now helped me to understand what they're shipping and what the manual means regarding Max Reduced and Low.

Basically from the manual, each L1 charger shipped with the car is country specific because they know the standard vac that it'll be used with. So mine in U.K. Is badged as a 230vac 10amp unit (it's printed on the rear of the unit :roll: ). This is presumably to ensure that it doesn't try to overload the standard 13amp wiring regime in the U.K. It would deliver 2.3kw as standard. I've just redone the maths from my Friday charge and this looks about right. I was plugged in for 4 hours or so and put in 27% SoC.

The 10amp rating presumably relates back to the table in the charging section of the manual which then gives the relevant current draw for each of the std chrg settings for each L1 charger / country.

So from the table if
Max = 10amps then
Reduced = 7.5amps
Low = 6amps

The only reason you'd choose Reduced or Low is if your wiring couldn't cope with delivering the default max.

Following on from this logic, when I plug my 230vac 32amp EVSE in, the pilot signal will tell the car it's an L2 charger not L1 and use the Fast chrg settings from iDrive.

The only bit I'm still confused by is Brian's post includes a 680ohm signal for a 20amp not specifically shown as L2. If such a wall box is plugged in, will the car interpret it as an L1 because there is no table entry over 15amp for L1 max. Or does it just draw that 15amp max as that's all the car can handle at L1 anyway.

Jeez, this is all too hard and my head hurts now!

 

[user 3172]

Okay Art, slowly having a light bulb moment. I obviously wasn't thinking straight these last few days.

The L1 charger that comes with the car as standard has a 3 pin domestic plug on one end and the usual python plug on the other. I was thinking the plastic box they're wound around was nothing more than some switches, ground detectors and LED indicators but having re-read Brian's earlier post, it's clearly acting as an EVSE and presumably putting out a pilot signal telling the car that it's attached to a normal household socket.

Brian's pilot signal post ....
Open - 6 A
1500 ohm - 13 A (stock L1 that comes with car)
680 ohm - 20 A (EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceCord 20, on order)
220 ohm - 32 A (L2 EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceBox Pro 40)
100 ohm - 63 A
50 ohm or < 100 ohm - 80 A

So, this now helped me to understand what they're shipping and what the manual means regarding Max Reduced and Low.

Basically from the manual, each L1 charger shipped with the car is country specific because they know the standard vac that it'll be used with. So mine in U.K. Is badged as a 230vac 10amp unit (it's printed on the rear of the unit :roll: ). This is presumably to ensure that it doesn't try to overload the standard 13amp wiring regime in the U.K. It would deliver 2.3kw as standard. I've just redone the maths from my Friday charge and this looks about right. I was plugged in for 4 hours or so and put in 27% SoC.

The 10amp rating presumably relates back to the table in the charging section of the manual which then gives the relevant current draw for each of the std chrg settings for each L1 charger / country.

So from the table if
Max = 10amps then
Reduced = 7.5amps
Low = 6amps

The only reason you'd choose Reduced or Low is if your wiring couldn't cope with delivering the default max.

Following on from this logic, when I plug my 230vac 32amp EVSE in, the pilot signal will tell the car it's an L2 charger not L1 and use the Fast chrg settings from iDrive.

The only bit I'm still confused by is Brian's post includes a 680ohm signal for a 20amp not specifically shown as L2. If such a wall box is plugged in, will the car interpret it as an L1 because there is no table entry over 15amp for L1 max. Or does it just draw that 15amp max as that's all the car can handle at L1 anyway.

Jeez, this is all too hard and my head hurts now!

 

[user 3172]

Okay Art, slowly having a light bulb moment. I obviously wasn't thinking straight these last few days.

The L1 charger that comes with the car as standard has a 3 pin domestic plug on one end and the usual python plug on the other. I was thinking the plastic box they're wound around was nothing more than some switches, ground detectors and LED indicators but having re-read Brian's earlier post, it's clearly acting as an EVSE and presumably putting out a pilot signal telling the car that it's attached to a normal household socket.

Brian's pilot signal post ....
Open - 6 A
1500 ohm - 13 A (stock L1 that comes with car)
680 ohm - 20 A (EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceCord 20, on order)
220 ohm - 32 A (L2 EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceBox Pro 40)
100 ohm - 63 A
50 ohm or < 100 ohm - 80 A

So, this now helped me to understand what they're shipping and what the manual means regarding Max Reduced and Low.

Basically from the manual, each L1 charger shipped with the car is country specific because they know the standard vac that it'll be used with. So mine in U.K. Is badged as a 230vac 10amp unit (it's printed on the rear of the unit :roll: ). This is presumably to ensure that it doesn't try to overload the standard 13amp wiring regime in the U.K. It would deliver 2.3kw as standard. I've just redone the maths from my Friday charge and this looks about right. I was plugged in for 4 hours or so and put in 27% SoC.

The 10amp rating presumably relates back to the table in the charging section of the manual which then gives the relevant current draw for each of the std chrg settings for each L1 charger / country.

So from the table if
Max = 10amps then
Reduced = 7.5amps
Low = 6amps

The only reason you'd choose Reduced or Low is if your wiring couldn't cope with delivering the default max.

Following on from this logic, when I plug my 230vac 32amp EVSE in, the pilot signal will tell the car it's an L2 charger not L1 and use the Fast chrg settings from iDrive.

The only bit I'm still confused by is Brian's post includes a 680ohm signal for a 20amp not specifically shown as L2. If such a wall box is plugged in, will the car interpret it as an L1 because there is no table entry over 15amp for L1 max? Or does it just draw that 15amp max as that's all the car can handle at L1 anyway.

Jeez, this is all too hard and my head hurts now!

 

[user 3172]

Okay Art, slowly having a light bulb moment. I obviously wasn't thinking straight these last few days.

The L1 charger that comes with the car as standard has a 3 pin domestic plug on one end and the usual python plug on the other. I was thinking the plastic box they're wound around was nothing more than some switches, ground detectors and LED indicators but having re-read Brian's earlier post, it's clearly acting as an EVSE and presumably putting out a pilot signal telling the car that it's attached to a normal household socket.

Brian's pilot signal post ....
Open - 6 A
1500 ohm - 13 A (stock L1 that comes with car)
680 ohm - 20 A (EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceCord 20, on order)
220 ohm - 32 A (L2 EVSE, eMotorWerks, JuiceBox Pro 40)
100 ohm - 63 A
50 ohm or < 100 ohm - 80 A

So, this now helped me to understand what they're shipping and what the manual means regarding Max Reduced and Low.

Basically from the manual, each L1 charger shipped with the car is country specific because they know the standard vac that it'll be used with. So mine in U.K. Is badged as a 230vac 10amp unit (it's printed on the rear of the unit :roll: ). This is presumably to ensure that it doesn't try to overload the standard 13amp wiring regime in the U.K. It would deliver 2.3kw as standard. I've just redone the maths from my Friday charge and this looks about right. I was plugged in for 4 hours or so and put in 27% SoC.

The 10amp rating presumably relates back to the table in the charging section of the manual which then gives the relevant current draw for each of the std chrg settings for each L1 charger / country.

So from the table if
Max = 10amps then
Reduced = 7.5amps
Low = 6amps

The only reason you'd choose Reduced or Low is if your wiring couldn't cope with delivering the default max.

Following on from this logic, when I plug my 230vac 32amp EVSE in, the pilot signal will tell the car it's an L2 charger not L1 and use the Fast chrg settings from iDrive.

The only bit I'm still confused by is Brian's post includes a 680ohm signal for a 20amp not specifically shown as L2. If such a wall box is plugged in, will the car interpret it as an L1? There is no table entry over 15amp for L1 max! Or does it just draw that 15amp max as that's all the car can handle at L1 anyway.

Jeez, this is all too hard and my head hurts now!

 

[jadnashuanh]

There is some confusion here...the J1772 standard was adapted for Europe and is called the IEC61851 standard. What the USA calls level 1 is called mode 1 in Europe. The difference in the USA between level 1 and level 2 is both the max current, and the inlet voltage, where level 1 is max of 16A and 120vac, whereas a mode 1 standard allows 240vac with 16A as a mode 1. As far as I can tell, in Europe, the pinout on a mode 1 and mode 2 cable is the same, but a mode 1 likely has smaller gauge wires. The EVSE indicates mode/level by the resistance on the pilot signal and the maximum current (as a percentage of the mode/level) by the PWM signal. SO, 100% of a mode/level 1 EVSE would be 16A, whereas 100% of a mode/level 2 device would be 32A (these are continuous values, not peak, which is higher).

 

[ramirojusto]

Hi everyone and sorry again for my delay!

I think that this conversation has become too advance for me! However, following the advice you provided me with, I changed the amperage of my EVSE to 32a, and know my car is charging at a faster rate. Actually, I tried many settings , from 6a to 32a, and I realized that the maximum "constant amperage rate" my car can deal with is something close to 21a, since there is no difference on charging times selecting 25a or higher on the EVSE. About the people that were worried how my EVSE was installed, many thanks for your concerns! I can tell you know that the handy man at work installed a 50A breaker and a 40A switch with the proper cable to deal with my 32a EVSE, so everything is safe.

Finally, and thanks to Bob Wilson, I also realized that the maximum charging rate that my car supports is 3,7 KWH. Since this car is going to be use for urban drives, right know I'm not concerned with that. However, I'd love to see the possibility of changing my car's KLE in the near future.

Thanks everybody again!

Ramiro

 

[jadnashuanh]

If I understand things, you don't have a KLE, but if you did, then, you'd be able to max out your charging capacity!

 

[alohart]

If I understand things, you don't have a KLE, but if you did, then, you'd be able to max out your charging capacity!

I wonder whether the addition of a KLE would add the "Fast chrg" iDrive entry that's missing.

 

[ramirojusto]

Hi,

Well, having a look at Bob post again I realised that my car does not have a KLE, but technically it could be possible to add one. However, I'm quite sure that the fast charging cable option won't appear in the car's charging menu without doing some coding, maybe with an OBD based tool like the one I used to add European radio frequencies to one BMW I brought from America to Europe.

As I wrote about in my former post, just as BMW is capable of changing the whole battery package for the new one, it shouldn't be so difficult to add a KLE, and if they want don't want to do It officially, Maybe in the future it wouldn't be so difficult to find a third party to perform such task.

Ramiro.