No Level 2 (Fast charging) option on my I3?

[ramirojusto]

Hi,

First of all, let me introduced myself. My name is Ramiro and I lived in Lisbon. Before I decided to write this post I checked the forum in order to avoid to ask something that's been asked before, so if that's case please accept my apologies in advance. I've just bought a i3 demo with just 500 kms from a a dealer in the Netherlands and imported to Portugal. It's a very basic car with no nav (but with a built-in GPS since I can check its position with the mobile phone app) nor high end audio system. It came with the standard domestic charger and a mennekes (level 2). However, and despite of this, my i3 only have the standard charge cable option (level 1) in the charging menu, so it always takes about 8 hours to charge even if it's connected to a wallbox with the mennekes cable, and that's exactly the same time it takes to charge with the standard cable. I do know that my i3 doesn't support DC charging, but I'd love to know if there's any chance to active the level2 option in my car's charging options.

I'll really appreciate your feedback!

Regards,

Ramiro

 

[alohart]

I was under the impression that "Level 1" (120V) and "Level 2" (208-240V) are North American terms with only single-phase 230V and 3-phase 400V charging (94 aH battery pack only) available in Europe. If so, there might be only one iDrive setting for charging speed in Europe. Do you have the charging speed set to "Maximum"? The maximum charging power of your i3 would be ~3.6kW assuming that it does not have the 7.2kW fast AC charging option. 3.6kW would be ~16A maximum charging current. Is your charging circuit capable of providing 16A? If so, the time it would take to charge your empty battery pack fully, assuming 20kWh (18.8kWh usable plus a bit extra due to less than 100% charging efficiency) and no reduced charging power as your battery pack nears full (not true), would be 20kWh / 3.6kW = 5.5h. So with the charging power tapering down as the battery pack nears full charge, 7 hours might be a reasonable estimate of the fastest full charging time possible which isn't too different from what you are experiencing.

 

[bwilson4web]

. . . I've just bought a i3 demo with just 500 kms from a a dealer in the Netherlands and imported to Portugal. It's a very basic car with no nav (but with a built-in GPS since I can check its position with the mobile phone app) nor high end audio system. It came with the standard domestic charger and a mennekes (level 2). However, and despite of this, my i3 only have the standard charge cable option (level 1) in the charging menu, so it always takes about 8 hours to charge even if it's connected to a wallbox with the mennekes cable, and that's exactly the same time it takes to charge with the standard cable. . . .

Welcome!

If you'll share the last 7 digits of your VIN, we can use the BMW VIN checker to understand your car equipment. The reason is this will let us know if perhaps there is a fast charger option in the equipment list.

It might help to add some photos of the "mennekes (level 2)" to let us investigate that equipment. The reason I ask is eMotorWerks sells both software configurable, WiFi enabled AC chargers and more basic units that are manually configured. It may be this unit is manually configured to limit the charging current.

Bob Wilson

 

[user 3172]

In all that I've read, I have never come across a car with only a Level 1 charge option. It's the DC fast charger that used to be the option in Europe but all came with L1 and L2 that I've seen although I am in UK which is trying not to be in Europe of course!

The charging options screen (Menu > Setttings > Charging) on my 94ah shows up as

With the "Fast chrg cable : Max" referring to L2 charging. So does your car only show the "Std chrg cable: Max" option?

 

[jadnashuanh]

The i3 can be configured with one or two on-board charging circuits...in the USA, we get the second (the KLE) 'standard'. In other markets, that can be an optional feature. As a result, the vehicle may not be able to charge as fast, regardless of the EVSE that is used. If I remember correctly, the level 1 EVSE indicates 120vac input, while a level 2 EVSE indicates a 240vac input. While not generally available in the USA, but it is in the standard, is the ability to use a 3-phase acv input and that adds another pin to the plug (and obviously the socket). Some people call the CCS level 3, but that is not really correct - CCS is the dcv input.

The EVSE that comes with the vehicle with 240vac power the norm, can just about max out the charging rate on the i3 if it does not have the KLE. If the logic holds true as it does in the USA, the car can be configured to limit the maximum power it uses. This is primarily to ensure you do not blow a fuse or pop a circuit breaker if the socket you've plugged into must share it's power with some other device, and, if both were on, would overload the circuit. Otherwise, the car will look at the pilot signal, and use as much as is available OR the max it was configured to utilize.

 

[alohart]

With the "Fast chrg cable : Max" referring to L2 charging. So does your car only show the "Std chrg cable: Max" option?

What is the distinction between "Std chrg cable" and "Fast chrg cable"? In North America, the car can distinguish between Levels 1 and 2 by the input voltage. Does a "Std chrg cable" refer to 230V single-phase charging whereas "Fast chrg cable" refers to 400V 3-phase charging (only on 94 aH models)?

 

[user 3172]

Okay, I'm no expert on all things i3 and electrical yet but here's how it appears.

All UK is 230vac input as standard

"Std chrg" appears to be L1 related and this is centred around the standard 3 pin plug charging unit that comes with the car. This charges off the 230vac input supply. Nominal rating on domestic sockets is 13amp so it can pull about 3kw off such a charger. As a domestic socket can't announce its power to the car, the onus falls on the user to set the charging power level, "Max", "Reduced" or "Low". If the circuit has no other load, Max should be fine. If however the circuit has additional load or is being used with a lower power extension cable then Reduced or Low my be appropriate to avoid tripping breakers, blowing fuses or even worse, melting wire.

"Fast chrg" appears to be L2 related and appears to be determined by the python / EVSE connection rather than anything else. As the EVSE can announce its supply to the car, the car can select the most appropriate power draw and Max should therefore be fine for this option.

I've tested the above theory as follows:-

1. Looked up specs on my EVSE. It puts out 230vac 50hz single phase so the car wouldn't be able to differentiate L1 from L2 just using supply voltage. It would be logical that if the car was only using voltage to determine L1/L2 that it would select L1 as the configuration (same as the 3 pin charger) and reference the relevant settings in the iDrive menu.

2. Set Reduced charge rate on L1. Plugged car into EVSE using python. The car commenced charging at 7.4kw i.e. maximum available from the EVSE and contrary to the L1 settings but in accordance with the L2 settings.

Now my logical conclusion is that the car treats a python / EVSE connection as L2 regardless of voltage but I appreciate that there could be another possibility. It could simply say "it's an EVSE, so ignore L1/L2 settings altogether and just use whatever it's got available!"

Hmmm, can't figure how to test that one?

 

[jadnashuanh]

ALL EVSE's announce how much power they can provide to the car via an output signal called the pilot signal. This assumes that the EVSE's input can support that as the EVSE has no way of knowing. IN the USA, the type of plug on the device is keyed to how much power it is plugged into, at least as a minimum. Standard receptacles in the USA are 15A, and there is a different shaped one that will support 20A (it's also backwards compatible with the 15A plug), then you get into 240vac (or more than the 120vac that is standard in the USA)...there's a 30A plug, then a 50A plug that are the most common. In the USA, there is a circuit breaker of fuse protecting the wall wiring...a device that is plugged in may also have an internal fuse or circuit breaker, but it is not required. It's my understanding that appliances that are plugged into things in the UK have a fuse or circuit breaker IN the device, so the protection is in the device, not what is feeding the wiring in the wall.

If you had an EVSE that could supply 20A, and the wiring can only supply 13A, you'd then need to tell the car to limit how much power it can draw.

Level 1 is 120vac input. Level 2 is 240vac inputs. You could easily have a level 1 device that could provide more power than a level 2 unit - IOW, it's not the amount of power it can supply, it's the supply voltage and internally in the EVSE, the power capacity of its internal components.

 

[bwilson4web]

From the BMW I3 training materials "101 High-voltage Components":

• The charging modes are defined in the international standard IEC61851-1 (IEC = International Electrotechnical Commission). . . . Charging mode 1 (Not Used ) . . . Charging mode 4 (Not Used )

So here is the standard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_62196

The resistance of the pilot signal line defines the current limit:

• Open - 6 A
• 1500 ohm - 13 A (stock L1 that comes with car)
• 680 ohm - 20 A (EVSE, eMotorwerks, JuiceCord 20, on order)
• 220 ohm - 32 A (L2 EVSE, eMotorwerks, JuiceBox Pro 40)
• 100 ohm - 63 A
• 50 ohm or < 100 ohm - 80 A

This is why knowing the exact type of EVSE, if not our stock BMW L1, is key to understanding the current limit along with the built-in equipment of the BMW i3. With the last seven characters of the VIN, we can quickly determine if the car can handle more than about ~3.2 kW.

For the original poster, there is a post in the forum that identifies the training materials. I throughly recommend searching for and downloading a copy. It provides a road-map to understand our cars.

Bob Wilson

 

[ramirojusto]

Thank you all for your help and my apologies for taking so long to answer,

Please find bellow the last 7 digits o the VIN

V305369

About my car charging menu, it only has the standard cable option but I wasn't able to add a picture to my post. How can I do that?

Finally, may car's Schuko cable it's rated at 12A, so I'm quite sure I won't be able to charge at a faster than that (even using my wall box), since acording to the manual the rated printed on that table is the maximum rate you can get when you choose the max rate in the charging menu.

Regards,

Ramiro

 

[alohart]

Please find bellow the last 7 digits o the VIN

V305369

You could enter the last 7 characters of your i3's VIN into the form at www.bmwvin.com or any of the many Websites that can decode BMW VIN's (Internet search is your friend).

About my car charging menu, it only has the standard cable option but I wasn't able to add a picture to my post. How can I do that?

This forum doesn't host photos, so you'd need to post your photo on another Website and use the URL to that photo with the "Img" tag available above the text entry field when creating a new post.

 

[ramirojusto]

Thanks Art, I've already done that. However, I'm still not able to know why my european spec car doesn't have the fast cable option available in the charging menu (it only has the standard cable one) nor if this is common among the less equipped i3s. They only thing that I can confirm is that my car takes to charge more or less the same time when is plugged to a standard European 230V plug with the 12a cable than when is plugged toa 230v 32a wall box with the mennekes cable. Even taking into account that I know that my car does not support 32a charging. It should charge take less to charge from the wallbox, shouldn't it?

Could this be a software limitation? I've just taken my i3 from the dealer and it was updated to the last European software option. However, it still doesn't have the DC fast charging option.

Thank you all for your feedback.

Ramiro

 

[bwilson4web]

Thank you all for your help and my apologies for taking so long to answer,

Please find bellow the last 7 digits o the VIN

V305369

It has been a while so I was surprised at how many 'download this' sites are out there ready to compromise your computer. Regardless, I checked your equipment list against mine, V277136, and it looks like I have two things missing from your list:

https://www.bmwdecoder.com/decode/v305369 - your list

https://www.bmwdecoder.com/decode/v277136 - my loaded BMW i3-REX:

S4U7A Rapid charging, direct current
S4U8A Rapid charging, alternating current

This suggests your car is limited to 3,2-3,7 kW rate. Disappointing, yes, but let's take a closer look at your options. My understanding is Portugal uses 220 VAC in house power. So the maximum draw with a 12 A, EVSE:

220 VAC * 12 A ~= 2,6 kW

In theory, 3.7 kW / 220 VAC ~= 16,8 A

Before "opening the bottle of sparkling vino," what are the current limits of your house circuits (i.e., fuse or circuit breaker)?

In North America we try to limit the maximum circuit draw to 80% of the fuse or circuit breaker. That suggests your house circuit would need 16,8 / 80% ~= 21 A.

Now I found this in the BMW i3 Training materials:

• A product of this kind offered for the AC voltage network in Germany can be used up to a current level of 16 A or up to a charging power of 3.7 kW. ("06_IO1-High-voltage-Componets.pdf", pp. 94)

If you can safely put a 16 A load on one of your house circuit(s), you might check German eBay or salvage sites to see if one of their EVSEs might be available. There is a USA company, eMotorWerks that is offering a software configurable EVSE that is rated up to 20 A.

. . .
About my car charging menu, it only has the standard cable option but I wasn't able to add a picture to my post. How can I do that?

Finally, may car's Schuko cable it's rated at 12A, so I'm quite sure I won't be able to charge at a faster than that (even using my wall box), since acording to the manual the rated printed on that table is the maximum rate you can get when you choose the max rate in the charging menu.
. . .

You fully understand the problem!

Is it worth it? The expected improvement in charging would be 2,6 kW / 3,7 kW ~= 70% of the original speed. One hour would become ~42 minutes. This makes the car much more practical.

Bob Wilson

 

[jadnashuanh]

Since power=volts*amps, and it is the EVSE that announces how many aps it can provide, regardless of the supplied voltage, if your voltage drops, the maximum power will too. Where you might get into a problem is if you tried to use an EVSE that announced to the car it could provide 30A, then the car tried to use that amount, and the wiring to the EVSE was only rated for say 15A. In the USA, the actual plug on the device would dictate the maximum it could draw, and to be 'legal' it would have to announce a current that was within what the supply could provide. So, you're limited by three things: what the EVSE says it can provide, what your EVSE is plugged or wired into, and what the car can utilize. Note, at least on the USA spec cars and I'd expect the Euro ones too, you can tell the car to limit how much it should draw. This is to protect the external wiring to the EVSE in case you have more than one thing plugged into the same circuit.

BMW's acv supplies in the car utilizes two modules. In the USA the second module is standard equipment...in others, it is an option.

 

[user 3172]

I've managed to find the sales literature for the pre 2017 model in U.K. Which I assume would mirror Netherlands cars to a large extent.

It appears that sometime prior to 2017, the Rapid AC charging (4U8) became standard on all cars but it looks like in the earliest cars, this was a priced option and I'm assuming this is where your issue arises from.

As Jim and Bob say, the best option is to provide a resilient dedicated circuit that'll handle around 20amps to allow you to safely pull the Max current from the Std chrg option.

FWIW Jim, wiring in U.K. does include fuses / breakers for input circuit wiring as well as at the consumer device end i.e. the thing that's plugged in. So my EVSE has a 32amp breaker protecting the dedicated circuit wiring from the mains supply to the EVSE from overload. The EVSE itself also has an inbuilt 32amp breaker in the event of internal fault and also to protect against excessive load.

The trouble with L1 is that most houses in U.K have "ring main" circuits operating many 13amp sockets protected with a single breaker. It's relatively easy to overload the ring by attaching several high draw items concurrently which would include the L1 charger of course. If I had to rely on L1 3 pin I would still install a dedicated line direct from the main fuse box with its own breaker.

 

[ramirojusto]

Good morning every one,

I think that because my English is a bit rusted I didn't explain myself as I should. I use to charge my car at work. We're taking about an recently built hotel with Its on electrical transformer, so capacity was never an issue. Taking that into account, I installed an 32a EVSE using a 32a breaker and the proper cable. It manages multiple amperages, so I chose 16a, since my car only have the standard cable option available in the charging menu, and it's supposedly limited to 12a. At the moment, the car takes more or less the same time charging from the standard socket or the EVSE. However, after I read all your valuable posts, I concluded that I should select the 20a option of the EVSE in order to taking advantage of the full charging rate that my my car supports (3,7 kwh), even if I'm limited to the maximum 12a rate that the charging menu in the car provides. Is that correct?

About the fast AC charging specification, I found that it's always been a no cost option and it continues to be so, at least in Portugal, Spain and France, and I find this suspicious. Since my car was licensed in March (it's relatively recent), couldn't be this a marketing strategy from BMW to boost the sales of its on wallbox? My apologies if in advance for being a bit rude, but I found stupid not include the very attractive ac fast charging option as standard equipment if they're not charging for it.

Finally, do you know if the limitation in my car is related to software or hardware? I'm asking this because if I'm not mistaken, and according to your replies, there are two circuit charging boards, one for the cars equipped with DC Fast charging (even the plug is different) and other for the rest ones. Therefore, if the limitation in my car is software related, maybe in the future BMW could release a software update or someone else could find an "independent" solution. What do you think about this?

Thank you all!

Ramiro

 

[user 3172]

According to the VIN decode

VIN WBY1Z21070V305369
Type code 1Z21
Type I3 (EUR)
E series I01 ()
Series I
Type HB
Steering LL
Doors 4
Engine IB1
Displacement 0.00
Power 125
Drive HECK
Transmission AUT
Colour CAPPARISWEISS MIT AKZENT BMW I BLAU (B85)
Upholstery STOFFKOMBI. NEUTRONIC/ARAGAZGRAU (BHGI)
Prod.date 2014-12-05
Vehicle options
S230 Extra package, EU-specific
S249 Multifunction f steering wheel
S2PA Wheel bolt retainer
S2VB Tire pressure display
S2VC Tire repair kit
S428 Warning triangle and first aid kit
S430 Interior/outside mirror with auto dip
S442 Cup holder
S473 Armrest front
S493 Storage compartment package
S521 Rain sensor
S534 Automatic air conditioning
S544 Cruise control with brake function
S570 Reinforced power supply
S5DA Passenger airbag deactivation
S6AC Intelligent emergency SOS call
S6AE Teleservices
S6AP Remote Services
S7AQ Battery Certificate
P7RS Package Comfort
S868 Language version, Dutch
S886 On-board vehicle literature Dutch
S8R9 Refrigerant R1234yf
S8S3 Automatic locking when driving off
S9AA Outer skin protection
S2D6 BMW LA wheel, Star Spoke 427
S548 Kilometer-calibrated speedometer

You say the car was licensed in March 2016 but this is way off the production date. Whilst a car produced in 2014 might not have had ac fast charging as standard (but possibly an option), a car produced in 2016 should have had it as standard in the EU if it mirrors the UK specification details I have.

I think you need to check with your dealer what you have purchased. If they have sold you a demonstrator mileage vehicle masquerading as a 2016 car when in fact it was produced in 2014, they need to be seriously hung out to dry! This is not on for a BMW main dealer.

 

[ramirojusto]

Hi Gif,

They never told me that it was a 2016 model. Deciphering the VIN number I assume that, in spite of the fact the car was produced in 2014, it's a 2015 year model. Here in Portugal, Spain and France the fast AC charging option its still an option for the 60ah cars, but a no cost one (which I find stupid). I have to assume know that isn't the case in the UK. Having realised that I'm stuck with standard charging option for the moment, my question is if I'm going to be able to charge my car faster if use the 20a of my EVSE instead of the 16a I'm using right know since I've got the same speed from my 230v standard plug.

Thanks again

Ramiro

 

[jadnashuanh]

You do NOT need to limit the car in the amount it draws from the EVSE UNLESS doing so would overload the circuit that the EVSE is on. You will NOT hurt the car or the EVSE if the EVSE can provide any amount (say 40A), even if the car can't use more than 20A. The EVSE announces how much its internal circuits can supply, then the car adjusts itself to never pull more than what the EVSE says it can provide, OR, the limit you've chosen from the car's menu system. If the EVSE says it can only supply 12A, the car will limit what it tries to take to that 12A.

IOW, if you have an EVSE with a higher capacity, and it is not a problem overloading its power feed, you will never hurt the car since the car won't draw more than what is available.

 

[bwilson4web]

What is missing is described in the training manual:

• The main task of the convenience charging electronics (KLE) during AC charging at 7.4 kW is the conversion of the AC voltage to direct current voltage. A rectifier switching in the KLE comprising two modules completes this task. These power electronics modules are controlled by a control unit, which also bears the same name: Convenience charging electronics (KLE).
  
  The convenience charging electronics is designed so it can provide a maximum electrical power of 3.7 kW on the output side. Together with the 3.7 kW from the standard power electronics of the EME, this is sufficient in the I01 to fully charge the high-voltage battery (at optimal marginal conditions) in three to six hours. This short charging time means enhanced comfort for the customer when using the I01. For this reason, this charging electronics was called "convenience charging electronics".
  
  The AC voltage is fed to the vehicle or the convenience charging electronics via a single-phase supply. The input voltage, which can be processed by the convenience charging electronics, may be in the following range: 100 V – 240 V, 50 Hz or 60 Hz. At the output, which is separated galvanically from the input, the convenience charging electronics supplies an electronically adjustable direct current voltage or an electronically adjustable direct current flows. The specifications for the output voltage and the output current come from the function "High-voltage power management" in the EME control unit. The values are calculated and adjusted by the KLE so that the high-voltage battery is optimally charged and the other consumers in the I01 are supplied with sufficient electrical energy.

It may be possible to retro-fit the KLE to the car but you'd have to ask BMW. Better to expand the EVSE power as much as it practical and plan on a future replacement.

Bob Wilson