Long List of Issues

[jadnashuanh]

Depending on when the car was built, a delivery in November 2014 may have had the updated KLE. If not, BMWNA was scheduling the replacements as the parts became available, at least on mine, not the dealer directly. MOst vehicles that landed around that time were held at the port to have them replaced.

If yours does have the original KLE, when you get back to HI, I'd just call the dealership and schedule the replacement.

 

[Jeffj]

Just as another point of reference, mine was built between Oct. 9 - 16, 2014, and it was built with the new KLE at the factory. My car was on the same boat as another member here, Sparky, and his was apparently held at the port to have the KLE replaced. Mine was released from the Port in only a day or two and was delivered to Colorado just after Thanksgiving. His was held for something like 2 weeks, if I remember. If you took delivery in November, then you were probably right on the cusp of whether you got the original KLE or the new one.

 

[WoodlandHills]

I had a similar feeling vis a vis the introduction of the smart Four2. We got two of the first cars to hit NA, followed all the forums for a couple years and still have one. There were a couple of small fleetwide issues (lubing the shifter comes to mind) but no lemon law buy backs and certainly none of the basic build quality issues such as have been reported here. The dealers, faced with a totally unfamiliar chassis, had no problems technically in servicing the cars either and parts were really cheap and arrived next day. And these were freshly created stand alone businesses staffed with all new-hires!

 

[alohart]

Depending on when the car was built, a delivery in November 2014 may have had the updated KLE.

The build date on my car is 1 August 2014, so it left the factory with a defective KLE. It arrived on the West Coast and was then transferred to another ship bound for Honolulu. I don't think it was held in port for a KLE replacement because I don't think they were available when my car reached the West Coast.

If yours does have the original KLE, when you get back to HI, I'd just call the dealership and schedule the replacement.

That's what I plan to do. I just expected to be notified. I suppose it's possible that somewhere along the line its KLE was replaced, but I'll find out soon.

 

[jadnashuanh]

BMW called my home number...so, maybe they did try to get ahold of you. Regardless, it should be no issue to have them replace it once you're back in HI.

From what I've found, while actually changing it doesn't take all that long (maybe half a day billed labor - probably shorter once they've done some), since BMW forces software updates from Germany, depending on their data connection and if there are any glitches, it may take a day to get all of the latest software installed afterwards. Some things are available at the dealers, but at least from my experience, on the i3, it comes from Germany and is customized to the VIN which takes into account the version number of any affected module. Since those also change, the same software doesn't always work, so it needs that custom touch. As I'm sure you are aware, there are lots of computers and therefore code in an i3 to make everything work, and it needs the right versions to work together.

FWIW, someone said, I haven't checked with the dealer, that the courtesy charging plug unlock won't work with the earlier builds, and I'm sure there are other things that are slightly different as well. Mine was built the end of April, 2014, so one of the earliest ones delivered to the USA. I've had a few issues, but none that have turned me off from the vehicle. It is my daily (well, I don't drive daily!) driver, and my ICE may not get used for a month or more. Eventually, I may trade them both in for something that I like that can perform the long-distance, and the EV running around, so that the ICE doesn't need to be used for my mostly short trips.

 

[alohart]

BMW called my home number...so, maybe they did try to get ahold of you. Regardless, it should be no issue to have them replace it once you're back in HI.

You could be correct. I expected a letter like I have received from Honda in the past. My voicemail message informed callers that I wouldn't be listening to voicemail messages, so send me an email message if they needed to contact me, but I didn't say that I was away. If BMW called me, they didn't try very hard to contact me. BMW sends me email messages several times each month, but nothing about the need to replace my KLE. Oh, well, I'll take care of this soon.

 

[M2140]

Now on your last comment. Carbon fiber is not the best material. If Tesla cars were made out of Carbon fiber they would be twice as expensive. Also, Carbon fiber is not the best material for cars. While it's very light & strong it's also brittle on impact, easily delaminates, and expensive to repair. BMW put a ton of strength into the aluminum chassis and structural support throughout the car so that the Carbon Fiber Pod would not take an impact.

That's some bold statements. Any facts, links etc to substantiate?

I'm a huge fan of EV's and have done a lot of research into them. The BMW i3 and the Tesla are by far the best and more viable EV's on the marker. But owners of Nissans, Chevy's, and yes Tesla get better support from their dealers than BMW owners. You have been lucky not having issues. Wait till you do and have to deal with the BMW dealer process.

Well, I happen to also own a Nissan (not a Leaf) and can't confirm that the support is better from them. In fact, it's as rubbish as anywhere else.

Also, I've actually had problems with my i3, though not down to quality or built. I had a front screen replaced (search for it on the forum here). The replacement was done eventually, but then needed another front pillar panel replacement (now done) and today I had slight scratches polished out of my black bonnet.

Altogether, I've probably been back six times now, so certainly have some battle scars as far as UK dealerships are concerned. My verdict so far: They are all going through a learning curve, but try their best to rectify it as soon as they can.

As mentioned before, I am sorry you've had troubles with both of your i3. But to call me "lucky" for not having had any problems is a tad strong and certainly does not reflect the true situation. Naturally, forums like this attract people with gripes. Good news is that nowadays readers of the same do realise this.

On my first I3 we had problems with getting Tint installed correctly due to the limited access to the rear side windows. We ended up removing the panels to find that the support on the POD were HUGE. There is a lot of reinforcement built into the support to account for the issues with Carbon Fiber.

Also, when buying the Tesla I was a little concerned about the insurance costs because of the price of the car and the nightmare stories I heard about minor damage causing the car to be declared a total loss because of the aluminum construction. I was very surprised to find that insuring the I3 (sticker maxes out at $55k) cost more to insurance than my Tesla (over $100k sticker). The I3 costs 25% more to insurance per year than my tesla.

 

[M2140]

So we finally got the I3 back this week and we are not Happy. After almost 2 weeks at the dealer here is status:

- Airbag / restraint error - Fixed
- I3 App does not communicate with the car - Not Supported
- Fast Charging causes certain features to be reset: - Not tested BMW says there is no issue
- Low Cost Charging randomly does not charge - Blamed on my BMW I charging Station
- Parcel shelf strap broke - Fixed.

We got a peak at the paperwork created for just this 1 visit and it was at least 1/2 in of paper involved. This is the first time this car had ever been to the dealer and it was a HUGE packet of paperwork.

The Dealer reset the car as part of the procedures but did not bother to set the time correctly on the car. Really nice of them to do that and not have the car charge correctly on it's first day back.


On the APP issue, I tried removing FUSE 115 & using the SOS button and neither improved communication. We are still hours behind and need to unlock the car to get any response. The Dealers response from BMW Engineering is still that the APP is not supported.
So I updated my request into BMW NA and got a very apologetic call that day from BMW NA. But there was nothing they could do. The lady on the phone was very nice and she is escalating my case to see if we can get some actual progress on this issue.



On the Low Cost Charing Issue, I had my electrician friend come down and check all of the connection on the Charge station and we will see if the issue comes up again.

Lastly, On the Fast Charging resetting features. The dealer could not test and BMW Engineering just dismissed out issue completely. There was no attempt to replicate at all. The dealer thinks that because the Airbag restraint system was shorting out it could be related. So we will have to go to our local Quick Charge station and test it out.


Overall, the experience at the BMW dealer was not good. the service guys was great but I think they could have fought for us a little harder on some of these issues. At the end of the day anything that BMW did not approve, just did not get done because there is no way they can get reimbursed for their time. So if Engineerings does not want to acknowledge an issue there is nothing the dealer can do.

In contrast, this week I took my Tesla in for service to repair the wheels. Big car meets curb at a local Mcdonals. It was the best service experience I've ever had. They were quick and attentive. I had a couple of other complaints that they fixed during the same visit. the service advisor kept me informed and nothing I said was taken for granted and they at least tried to replicate. Big difference in how Tesla treats their customers.

 

[WoodlandHills]

I am astounded that the APP is not supported!

BMW is NOT a premium car company. I thought it was before I leased my i3, but they have convinced me otherwise. NEVER AGAIN!

 

[M2140]

So here is another update.

I had my electrician check the charger and we confirmed that with my tesla can draw the full 30 amps with no problem. He was able to confirm the amperage on the line and I could see the draw on the Tesla dash. So my home charger is good. He checked all the cabling and checked the junction box to make sure everything was cabled up correctly and there were no issues or signs of issues.

But Last night, With Low Cost Charging enabled and a departure time of 4:30am; the car did not charge to 100%.

We have Low cost charging set between, 10 pm & 6 am. With a 4:30 am departure time we usually get 100% charge with around 80-92 mile Projected range depending on the driving mode selected.
This morning at 4:30 am the car was still charging at 4:30 and was around 96%. Because the battery was warm from charging the range was reduced to 69 in Eco Pro mode.

This has me really worried. Normally the car starts to charge around 11 or midnight. The car would then fully charge in 4.5 hours. Last night i unlocked the doors at 10pm and saw it start charging. I was very surprised to see it had not fully charged 6.5 hrs later. Man I hope i don't have another lemon.

 

[psquare]

So here is another update.

I had my electrician check the charger and we confirmed that with my tesla can draw the full 30 amps with no problem. He was able to confirm the amperage on the line and I could see the draw on the Tesla dash. So my home charger is good. He checked all the cabling and checked the junction box to make sure everything was cabled up correctly and there were no issues or signs of issues.

But Last night, With Low Cost Charging enabled and a departure time of 4:30am; the car did not charge to 100%.

We have Low cost charging set between, 10 pm & 6 am. With a 4:30 am departure time we usually get 100% charge with around 80-92 mile Projected range depending on the driving mode selected.
This morning at 4:30 am the car was still charging at 4:30 and was around 96%. Because the battery was warm from charging the range was reduced to 69 in Eco Pro mode.

This has me really worried. Normally the car starts to charge around 11 or midnight. The car would then fully charge in 4.5 hours. Last night i unlocked the doors at 10pm and saw it start charging. I was very surprised to see it had not fully charged 6.5 hrs later. Man I hope i don't have another lemon.

I don't think you've got a lemon. I have observed the same effect on mine when using the departure time and off-peak charging (why these 2 are connected, I still don't entirely understand, by the way).

I have noticed that with a departure time of 8:15am, if I check SOC at 7am, the car is at 100% and stopped charging. However, 45 mins later the car is back at 96% and charging. My guess is that this is connected to the battery precon, which changes battery temperature and affects the SOC and makes it drop. Ambient temperature might also be a factor. This then in turn makes the charging mode to come on again. I have raised this with my BMW I dealership and they told me that one other owner has reported the same. I was told that this was raised with BMW Germany.

On multiple occasions I also had the effect that -despite departure time and off-peak enabled- the car would start charging immediately and outside the off-peak window when I plug it in the night before. However, I think this only happens if the SOC is particularly low and is there by design to protect the batteries. In other words, it won't wait until off-peak and just goes ahead and starts charging. At about 17 or 18%, it will turn off and then wait for the off-peak window to complete the charge.

Thankfully, this is documented nowhere! (hang on!)

 

[WoodlandHills]

Mine will do the same, but will not turn off. It charges to 100% then shuts off. We just don't plug the car in until it is the low cost charging time: we cannot trust it.

 

[M2140]

One of the ways to save money by driving an EV is to Low Cost charge at night during Super Off peak hours. Here in California, EV owners get special rates from 10 pm to 8 am on the EV plan. They call the time super off peak and only charge $0.08 a kW. It a big difference in cost, because Super Off Peak costs $1.60 a day to charge compared to $7.60 during peak hours when i get home. Having to charge the i3 during peak hours makes no sense and actually costs more than driving a Prius.

BMW needs to fix Low cost charging. My dealer and BMW NA acted like nothing was wrong and just brushed it off by claiming my station was the problem.

So last night I tried an experiment. I removed all Low cost timers while the car was connected. I used the app and FINALLY got a change to go thru. Once the I3 started charging it read 3.3 hrs to recharge. This first blew me away because it only had 10% batter and normal this takes 4.5 hrs with low cost charging.
I then started the Tesla to charge. The Tesla has an 80amp draw so it could impact the i3. I checked at 5 minutes and the I3 was not affected. I checked again at 30 minutes and the time on the I3 had improved by 30 min (originally read completion at 1:30 am and improved to 1 am)

Conclusion: Without Low cost charging not only is charging more stable, but faster. How can this be?

Tonight I'm going to try and drain the battery down and set Low Cost charging back on. If charging is slower and still inconsistent i think there is a serious software bug on the I3.

 

[Blue20]

...

I have noticed that with a departure time of 8:15am, if I check SOC at 7am, the car is at 100% and stopped charging. However, 45 mins later the car is back at 96% and charging. My guess is that this is connected to the battery precon, which changes battery temperature and affects the SOC and makes it drop. Ambient temperature might also be a factor. This then in turn makes the charging mode to come on again. I have raised this with my BMW I dealership and they told me that one other owner has reported the same. I was told that this was raised with BMW Germany.

...

Just wondering are you using L1 or L2 charging. I have seen pre-condition pulled as much as 2.5kW. If you are using L1, then the pre-condition may draw more power than L1 can supply. This may explain the dip back down to 96%.

 

[jadnashuanh]

There's a bit of hysteresis built into the charging algorithm, in that once it gets to 100% and shuts off, it won't turn back on again until it drops some amount. I've seen my i3 draw up to 20A at 245vac while preconditioning prior to departure time...that's much more power than the 120vac L1 OUC can provide, so it will drop off. A full capacity L2 unit should be able to keep up, and if you don't leave earlier than your set time, it probably would get back to 100% by then as well.

 

[Schnort]

Here in California, EV owners get special rates from 10 pm to 8 am on the EV plan. They call the time super off peak and only charge $0.08 a kW. It a big difference in cost, because Super Off Peak costs $1.60 a day to charge compared to $7.60 during peak hours when i get home.

Wow! It definitely wouldn't be worth driving at $7.60 for a day. How many KWH is that?

My rates aren't time based, and they peak out at $0.11/KWH depending on monthly consumption. Even at that, I think it's only ~$0.50 a day for my commute (around 22 miles round trip)

 

[M2140]

Here in California, EV owners get special rates from 10 pm to 8 am on the EV plan. They call the time super off peak and only charge $0.08 a kW. It a big difference in cost, because Super Off Peak costs $1.60 a day to charge compared to $7.60 during peak hours when i get home.

Wow! It definitely wouldn't be worth driving at $7.60 for a day. How many KWH is that?

My rates aren't time based, and they peak out at $0.11/KWH depending on monthly consumption. Even at that, I think it's only ~$0.50 a day for my commute (around 22 miles round trip)

In So Cal power is really expensive. Peak rates are at $0.38 per KWH. I drive about 80 miles a day round trip. So peak charging adds up fully charging the car every day. Most people plans are tiered where your rate is based on how much power you use. Certain number of KW are on Tiers 1 and if you use more, the cost per KW goes up.

With time based EV plans, you can move all your EV charging to super off peak times and you pay the same rate per KW no matter how much power you use.

I changed over to the EV plan last year when i first got the I3. Even though we are using FAR more power, our electricity bill is much lower because it's mostly all during super off peak times.