BMW i3 Trade-in value - surprisingly depressing

[spinball]

I've read some things that seem to claim Tesla uses much lower quality "laptop type" battery cells. The claim was their life is only 6-8 years where the i3 batteries are supposed to be good for 21 years.

We shall see if that's true or not. Would be quite a nasty turn of events for Tesla if true (and it may not be so).

 

[jadnashuanh]

FWIW, it's my understanding that Tesla uses a much smaller battery cell. TO get the power they have, that means LOTS of them, and each one's connection is an opportunity for a failure.

 

[Keganbmwi3]

I just wanted to pop in I am new on here, just bought my i3 REX 51500 msrp, I bought it used it was on the traded in for a BEV 13k miles 30k out the door.

 

[jadnashuanh]

BMW made the REx version to allay the range anxiety...not necessarily because it made the car more functional for the intended user. The BEV fits my needs just fine. I think if I needed a REx, I'd have looked at a different vehicle. The current battery tech doesn't make long-range EV use particularly practical, and while you can do it in say a Tesla, stray off the beaten path with it, and IF you can find a way to recharge it, be prepared to wait MANY hours, as there just aren't that many super chargers out there. The closest one to me is nearly 100-miles away, and not in an area that I frequent.

The average home these days isn't setup for a major additional high-current device. Put a bigger battery into things so you can get much longer ranges, and unless you are willing to pay the potentially big bucks to upgrade your local electrical service, you're stuck with charging at a slower rate or searching out a public location that can do it (and there aren't many of them, either!). 30A or so may be too big for some older residences, and was a stretch for my townhouse. My power runs through 6 other townhouses to the meter, so upgrading wasn't feasible. I don't know what I'd do with a significantly larger battery. Yes, newer batteries are likely to be more energy dense, and may be able to be recharged faster, but it still takes WATTS that you may not have available! Try recharging your 85Kw Tesla from empty with 30A overnight...you won't have a full charge the next day if you did anything the evening beforehand.

So, wish for bigger batteries, the additional weight and required infrastructure may make it less usable than what we have now. CCS units in a home are not currently practical, either from their cost standpoint or the required power company hookup available to most of us.

The shape of the Leaf's storage area in the rear was useless to me for what I wanted to carry. Nor did I particularly like the way it looked.

 

[Keganbmwi3]

So I was a Volt owner before my i3, I travel for work and take it over 100 miles no problem. I have great driving habits and drive the routes that suit Eco pro+ and I got up to 102 miles on a charge!!!

I love the car and I am so happy to make he switch!!! Everyone can rant about how Rex is maybe not the way to be full EV but most of the time I never use the Rex but I need it just in case work takes be out of of they range. Plus my wife really would hate to be tied town to full EV car, I get what I want more EV range than my volt and she can still feel ok driving it when I am gone that she won't end up without charge.

I have older house and I have a Bosch power xpress 30amp and I have adaptor for NEMA 14-50 so I can hit a lot of places. It is hard take it with me it isn't huge but not small and super compact. My home charging is fast couple hours at the most. I find the car great over my volt I just wish it tought better driving habits, the volt does they very well.

 

[psquare]

Try recharging your 85Kw Tesla from empty with 30A overnight...you won't have a full charge the next day if you did anything the evening beforehand.

Jim, I wouldn't for a second claim to know more about this than you, but I've read about much shorter Tesla charging times. Something between 4-9 hours, depending on whether you have the single or twin-charger (which obviously comes at a price). See here:

https://www.cars.com/articles/2013/11/how-quickly-does-the-tesla-model-s-battery-charge/

 

[alohart]

Jim, I wouldn't for a second claim to know more about this than you, but I've read about much shorter Tesla charging times. Something between 4-9 hours, depending on whether you have the single or twin-charger (which obviously comes at a price).

The single charger is a 10 kW unit with the double charger being 20 kW. So for the maximum charging speed with a single charger, an EVSE would need to supply 40 amps from a 50 amp 240 volt circuit. The double charger would require an 80 amp EVSE powered by a 100 amp circuit. Jim was commenting about a 30 amp circuit (24 amps maximum continuous power) which would take much longer to charge than 9 hours.

 

[jadnashuanh]

What the car is capable of verses what you can actually find to plug into are often two different things! Take even the i3, IF you have access to a CCS unit, 30-minutes to 80% from nearly empty, and about double that to full. But, you don't have one at home, and on the entire east coast of the USA, there's less than 25 or so and none within range of my car!

Most of the public level 2 EVSE's out there are running off 208vac power, and if they are 30A, that's only 6.2Kw/hr. Throw your Tesla on it which may need 85Kw to recharge and see how long it takes! It's irrelevant in many cases how fast you CAN charge, it's how big the device you plug into is.

Then, I still contend that the average home does NOT have 80A free on their power panel unless it was specifically installed with that intent for an EV. A more typical 30-40A unit is a stretch for some.

You can look at the ideal situation, but few people live in that ideal world. There isn't a Tesla superstation in my entire state, and if I did have one, just to use it, I'd lose about 1/3 or more of my available range since I don't generally travel that direction! There are VERY few CHademo DC fast chargers east of CA, either. When you look at the entire country, and all of the very large companies that have agreed to go with CCS and J1772, the prospect of better coverage looks much brighter if you open your eyes. It will take time. Level 2 units are fairly easy to install. Running power (if it is available, often not) to a CCS unit is a major endeavor, and the unit could be 50x more expensive to buy than an EVSE. Without incentives, there has to be a fairly big market to justify the expense with any expectation of recovering your costs...they aren't putting these things in for goodwill unless coerced - there has to be a market case for it. You can put in a gas station and expect nearly 100% of the passing vehicles could stop and utilize it. How many EV's are there out there, and then compare the time required to fulfill their needs?

Some people buy things on a whim without research...hey, a car is a car, it will perform like any other car I've owned! BS...EVs are a different animal. How much responsibility is it of the seller to educate you? They should have the answers if you ask questions, but hey, buyer beware! My i3 is meeting all of my expectations. Do I wish it may do a few other things? Certainly, but I did my research and decided the benefits outweighed the deficiencies. As to range...how many people get the EPA rated performance on the car they own? Some, IF their driving conditions are similar. How often does that happen? Based on the way the EPA measures things (you can argue whether it's right or not), the i3 BEV gets 124MPGe...do you know any other car that can go 124 miles on a gallon of gas equivalent? How you drive and the weather conditions and where you drive all affect an ICE as well as an EV. Cold starts, short trips in the winter, my ICE might get 1/3-less MPG than in the summer. Even on a long trip, winter to summer (partly because of the ethanol, but where I live, we get that all year), I'll typically see around a 15% degradation.

Things will only get better, but I'm not disappointed in what I have...my i3 does what I wanted and expected it to do.

 

[psquare]

I'm also glad that I did my homework before ordering my i3 REx. The importance of research, comparisons and test drives cannot be stressed enough.

Unfortunately, too many posters on here seem to buy the car on a whim and are then disappointed if it doesn't fit with their lifestyle and/ or expectations.

Just as you, I'm absolutely happy with our i3. A BEV would have been the wrong choice for me, as my mileage can occasionally fluctuate and I need this kind of buffer for 3-5% of my journeys.

I took the car on a 860 mile round trip to Germany and back recently, which could have been done entirely on electricity. However, when there was no CCS for 90 miles, it was convenient to decide to use the REx for 45 mins instead of stopping at a slower Type 2 charger. On the way back I probably used the REx for 80-90 miles. Again, it was convenient to have this facility for about 20% of my inward journey.