New i3 purchase

[Jeremy]

Hi

New member in SW UK - just about to place an order with the following spec:-

i3 with REx in Andesit Silver
Cold weather package
Professional media package (FOC)
Park assist
Lodge interior (subject to seeing it - otherwise Suite)
Rapid charge prep
Adaptive LED headlights
Driving assistant plus
Electric glass sunroof
Internet
428 19" wheels
Home charging unit (if my garage supply can supply the amps)

There are a couple of items I don't fully understand - and I'm not certain the dealer will either - so I'd be grateful for any advice or general comments on the spec.

1. Does the heat pump supply the cabin heating continually (and thereby reduce battery useage) - or is it just to pre-heat cabin?

2. Is it true that you can use your smartphone to switch on cabin preheat before you get to the car?

3. The dealer has given me a written quote including REx and heat pump - but I thought I read somewhere (here I think) that you couldn't have them both - have they screwed up on this?

4. Didn't order Winter Package 'cos I hate heated seats and haven't switched them on in my Lexus RXH for 8yrs - but I'm not sure what I'm missing out on under "Preheating of battery with active flap control".

5. I'm assuming I have to have Rapid Charge Prep to use public charging points - is that right?

6. Are there any of the above installed or imminent in Bath/Bristol area?

Many thanks in advance to anybody who's done a bit more research and can fill in any blanks for me.

After some exotic ones in my youth, I got bored with cars in later life - but I find I'm feeling quite excited about this one!

 

[SanSerif]

Hi!

I agree about this being an interesting car. First car I've bought in years that I'm actually excited about again.

Answering some Qs in the wrong order:

3. I think there's been a screw up; from everything I've read, you can't order Heat Pump and REx together. Not least because they both go in the same physical location!

5. Public charging is an interesting topic. AFAICT, the situation is a confused mess right now - and there are no i3 rapid chargers in the UK (despite this being an EU std). However, Ecotricity have indicated that they intend to roll out this type as do some of the recently announced council schemes (Hampshire, for example). I've ordered the rapid charge fit purely on faith that there'll be some chargers not too long from now. In the meantime, you can plug into public "fast" chargers (Type 2 I think (I'm still learning)) for a slower charge - without the "rapid" charge option.

2. AIUI, you can trigger pre-heat by either timer or smartphone "remote". There's been some debate as to whether you need the Heat Pump option for this pre-heating - but I think the last opinion I saw was that you don't.

1. The Heat Pump will be used whenever you use the heater; reducing battery drain at all times.

 

[Jeremy]

Thanks SS

Very useful.

If I get any more info from BMW I'll post it.

 

[Stevei3]

Hi Jeremy,

I, for myself, would not think twice about getting the heated seats just to get the battery precon. It is not even that expensive. It will be a great boon when charging the battery in wintery conditions. Lithium batteries tend to work less than great when cold.

Also, keep in mind that there is much confusion about the cabin precon. Latest info (according to the Dutch info) suggest that the heat-pump is not needed for this. Cabin precon should work with or without REx or heatpump when the car is hooked up to the mains, according to the latest news.

Regarding the speed charge option: I don't know if you *need* it for charging at public sites, but it could well be. If you don't mind using the REx you could do without it. I opted to include the extended charger however.

Steven

 

[Jeremy]

Thanks Steve

More food for thought,

Do you know if the battery pre-heat runs continually? Or do you have to initiate it remotely a certain time before you intend to use the car. Does it help with the charging process itself - or just the first few miles of cold running.

There doesn't seem to be much in depth technical info on the BMW website and the dealers seem to be learning as they go.

I think; like you, I'll stick with the DC fast charge option - just for peace of mind on long journeys. There is nothing in the world more frustrating than a dead car far from home.

 

[AndrewDebbie]

I have a few answers....

1. Does the heat pump supply the cabin heating continually (and thereby reduce battery useage)

Yes.

2. Is it true that you can use your smartphone to switch on cabin preheat before you get to the car?

Won't know this for certain until we get the UK production cars. -- Need to see if it actually works.

3. The dealer has given me a written quote including REx and heat pump - but I thought I read somewhere (here I think) that you couldn't have them both - have they screwed up on this?

The BMW price list I have here says REx is not compatible with the Heat Pump. EIther the price list is wrong (it happens) or your dealer is.

4. Didn't order Winter Package 'cos I hate heated seats and haven't switched them on in my Lexus RXH for 8yrs - but I'm not sure what I'm missing out on under "Preheating of battery with active flap control".

I strongly recommend this option. If you don't get battery preheating, winter range will be greatly reduced. A cold battery doesn't hold nearly as much charge as one at 20C.


Leaf owners with heated seats tend to use the seat heaters instead of the cabin heat. The seat heaters use far less power.

5. I'm assuming I have to have Rapid Charge Prep to use public charging points - is that right?

No. You would not be able to use public rapid charge points. You would be able to use public fast charge points.

Fast charge points recharge the car in 3 to 4 hours. When compatible rapid charge points appear (there aren't any yet) they will charge the car in 30 minutes.

6. Are there any of the above installed or imminent in Bath/Bristol area?

Ask Ecotricity about their rapid charge plans. For fast chargers, there are several competing charging maps. Some of them are less accurate than others.

 

[Stevei3]

Hi Jeremy,

well, as you experienced, BMW's info is sketchy to say the least. Nobody (BMW, press, us ) seems to be exactly right about anything outside the obvious.

That aside, my guess is that the battery precon will run while (or before) charging and perhaps when starting your journey, 'cause lithium cells have no trouble keeping a charge at low temperatures, but the can't be charged or discharged (ie. used) to their capacity when cold. I guess the precon is switched off after a while when the batteries themselves generate enough warmth when charging or discharging.

@ AndrewDebbie: 3 hour charge will not work in a NL specced car (in UK maybe it does, I don't know) when not ordering the speed charger. In standard trim, the car only charges with 3.6 kW (=6-8 hours). The speed charger, aside from enabeling DC fast charging, doubles this to 7.2 kW on AC (I believe this is called mode 2, but correct me if I'm wrong)

Steven

 

[AndrewDebbie]

According the to price lists I have seen 4U8 -- Fast Charge Preparation is standard in the UK.






However 4U8 is bundled with 4U7 (Rapid Charging) on the German price list.




The price list is probably correct but BMW UK's price lists and brochures have been wrong before. Until the cars are in customer hands we have no way to be certain. We had exactly that problem with our Z4. Something that the UK brochure said was standard on our car turned out to be not available even as an option.

 

[Plug]

BMW UK's price lists and brochures have been wrong before.

Having seen the detailed pics from Frankfurt there is something in the UK brochure that doesn't quite make sense to me so I emailed BMW to ask (they are looking into it and going to get back). I won't go into details here because it's most likely that I have it wrong so no point muddying the water. Interesting to know that UK brochures have been incorrect in the past though.

 

[AndrewDebbie]

2. Is it true that you can use your smartphone to switch on cabin preheat before you get to the car?

There is a remote app for iPhone and Android


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DweD1LQlvMA&feature=youtu.be


Your question is answered starting around 1:19.


We won't know how well this works until people get their cars. Of course both your phone and your car need a good cell signal.


Remote control heat mostly works on Leaf but can be tricky to set up. Renault will probably never fix remote heating on the Fluence.

 

[Jeremy]

Thanks Andrew

I've had a reply from the dealer now, as follows:-

1. By having a range extender the small 649cc engine is placed in the rear of the vehicle, taking up the space where a heater pump would be fitted.

Meaning a i3 REX could not have a cold weather package and therefore not provide direct controlled cabin temperature control. Although the smartphone control you described is 100% accurate due to the above this could not be included in the specification you have listed.

2. The pre heating of the modules, simply puts the batteries in a optimum state of efficiency, benefiting the economy of the vehicle due to battery technology in lithium ion batteries performing initially lower in cold weather.

3. Regarding DC rapid charge and AC fast charge, for public uses I would say AC is currently the most common public source of charging, however if a rapid 30min charge time is preferable then it would make more sense as the DC network growths to have this input fitted.

So it looks like you were right about REx & Heat Pump being incompatible - that's a pity, I was looking forward to warming it up with my phone on cold mornings!

I still don't fully understand whether battery preheating helps the battery accept more charge or just helps to release charge more evenly.

If if actually means the battery can store more charge in cold weather - being in UK, I think I should have it.

We don't seem to have any 30min rapid charge stations guaranteed in my area yet - but since I'm planning on keeping this car a long time I guess I should have that as well.

At last the BMW specification fog is clearing slowly.

 

[AndrewDebbie]

The battery will take more charge if it is near 20C than it will at 0C.

An i3 without the Winter Package and Cold Weather cabin preparation will have greatly reduced winter range.




Gen 1 Leaf doesn't have a heat pump and limited cold weather battery heating.

Here is a graph for Nissan Leaf based on real usage

http://news.fleetcarma.com/2013/01/31/electric-car-range-in-bitter-cold/

 

[Jeremy]

Andrew

Yes - I see you're right. Li-ion charge rates are reduced at low temperatures and cause permanent damage to the battery below 0 deg C.

http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/charging_at_high_and_low_temperatures

But since they are obviously going to sell the cars into cold environments - doesn't this mean there must always be some form of battery heating system to prevent damage?

I've also read that the life of Li-ion cells reduces rapidly at high temperatures - so I wouldn't buy one if i lived in Florida.