Is 150 miles possible at motorway speeds?

nowtta60 · Sep 11, 2014

I live just north of Brum, and commute down to Southampton for 2 weeks at a time. Just been looking into google maps and the total trip length is 154 miles. So theoretically doable with 75 miles from the battery and a bit more from the REX.

On the way back on Fridays the M3/A34/M40/M42 is pants, and speeds rarely exceed 60 so have no worries about making the trip in 1 go.

However on Sundays traffic is clear - so I'd like to stick the cruise on at 70 on the way down the M42/M40 - engage the charge hold on the rex till I'm in range of final destination on EV power - probably somewhere just after leaving the M40 and getting on the A34.

My biggest concern is that I'll have to stop to top up the tank somewhere on the A34 as it will be just past the max combined range of battery + tank. Not the end of the world - but if it's 3 degrees above 0 and chucking it down horizontally - I might start to regret the purchase. I'd like to keep plenty of battery as the last bit down the M3 between Winchester and Southampton is quite hilly - don't want to hit snail mode and be holding up lorries and caravans!

I guess the reality is - if I find I do have to stop then I'll be able to stop worrying about keeping the speed down and just keep up with traffic flow on the A34 - knowing the REX Will keep topping off the battery when I get stuck behind slower cars ;-) Daft really though - going faster means it will take longer to get there as the pit stop will work against those couple of minutes saved at higher speeds.

I've looked into the fast DC option and picking up a charge half way and skip using petrol - but we've got a child under 1 and want to stop as little as possible. Plus the cost is almost that of petrol! £7.50 for 1/2 hour with chargemaster. You then have to add on the cost of a Burger King/KFC vs eating at home 45 mins later ;-)

Blighty · Sep 11, 2014

have a look at www.zap-map.com

Ecotricity have CCS charger at the A34/M4 Services and I understand they are installing CCS charge point at all their sites on the UK motorway network.

nowtta60 · Sep 11, 2014

Thanks have seen that before. What I'm really after is some feedback from other rex owners on what their max range is in the real world. And how far they can get before range anxiety sets in and a stop at a charger or petrol station becomes necessary.

Really I dont want to feel that the i3 is a compromise on my needs.

I'm starting to think about cancelling my order and hanging on till late 2015 and ordering a Tesla instead. Given that for the forseable future I plan on doing the 300 mile round trip every 2 weeks it might be a better option.

The i3 would be perfect for the rest of my motoring, which is not a lot as I live 1 mile from where I work so can cycle and just take the car when it rains. That and some shopping and running around at weekends covers it. But that long trip is not ideal for what is basically a city car.

BoMW · Sep 11, 2014

nowtta60 said:
Thanks have seen that before. What I'm really after is some feedback from other rex owners

I'm starting to think about cancelling my order and hanging on till late 2015 and ordering a Tesla instead. Given that for the forseable future I plan on doing the 300 mile round trip every 2 weeks it might be a car.

For constant long mileage the i3 is a compromise and if you can afford the tesla model x then this is the car to have.
I3 range is unpredictable, head winds, load, speed can effect it. I've had a surplus 16 miles of motorway driving to only vanish and leave me with a 10 mile short fall.

Winter and low temperatures will also have a detrimental effect on range.

Bunter · Sep 12, 2014

I think you've already answered your own question. If your lifestyle means you are concerned about making stops en route then this probably isn't the car for you.

But I think a Rex with the DC charge option could stop at A34/M4 Chievley services to charge the battery (currently free) and fill the REX tank on the way down.

Bill

amateurish · Sep 12, 2014

I don't think you'll reliably get 154 miles at 70-80 mph. A stop is likely. You will probably have to drive nearer 60 mph to make it without stopping. Although this will probably be quicker overall than travelling at 70 and stopping for a rapid charge a Chieveley.

jadnashuanh · Sep 12, 2014

Any vehicle, ICE or hybrid or EV will have it's range affected by not only the ambient conditions, but also the terrain and how you drive it. The base Tesla is rated at about 160-miles on a charge. So, depending on how you drive it, that 150-miles, could be an issue. Or, you can pony up another $25K (in the US) for the bigger battery, and end up paying more than twice the price of an i3.

TonyWilliams · Sep 13, 2014

jadnashuanh said:
The base Tesla is rated at about 160-miles on a charge. So, depending on how you drive it, that 150-miles, could be an issue. Or, you can pony up another $25K (in the US) for the bigger battery, and end up paying more than twice the price of an i3.

Are you kidding? The base Tesla has a 60kWh battery (three times the i3) and an EPA rated 208 mile range.

The 85kWh Tesla is $10,000 USD more for 265 miles.

160 miles would be very easy in a Model S.

Plus, those 25kW to 44kW chargers CCS chargers are not much competition for the 135kW Supercharger network.

You get what you pay for.

mindmachine · Sep 13, 2014

TonyWilliams said:
jadnashuanh said:

The base Tesla is rated at about 160-miles on a charge. So, depending on how you drive it, that 150-miles, could be an issue. Or, you can pony up another $25K (in the US) for the bigger battery, and end up paying more than twice the price of an i3.

Click to expand...

Are you kidding? The base Tesla has a 60kWh battery (three times the i3) and an EPA rated 208 mile range.

The 85kWh Tesla is $10,000 USD more for 265 miles.

160 miles would be very easy in a Model S.

Plus, those 25kW to 44kW chargers CCS chargers are not much competition for the 135kW Supercharger network.

You get what you pay for.

You are correct and at only about twice the price @ $ 86,920 equipped with just a few of the basic extras like a charging connector, heated seats, metallic paint and leather interior, led interior lighting, comparable options but probably higher end. So yea about twice the price of a i3 Tera BEV. However you are correct 208 mile range and a lower efficiency in miles per kwh.

A lot nicer in many ways but at almost twice the price , I will pass for sure.

kevinb61 · Sep 13, 2014

TonyWilliams said:
jadnashuanh said:

The base Tesla is rated at about 160-miles on a charge. So, depending on how you drive it, that 150-miles, could be an issue. Or, you can pony up another $25K (in the US) for the bigger battery, and end up paying more than twice the price of an i3.

Click to expand...

Are you kidding? The base Tesla has a 60kWh battery (three times the i3) and an EPA rated 208 mile range.

The 85kWh Tesla is $10,000 USD more for 265 miles.

160 miles would be very easy in a Model S.

Plus, those 25kW to 44kW chargers CCS chargers are not much competition for the 135kW Supercharger network.

You get what you pay for.

Any i3-Tesla comparison is silly. Apples and Oranges. Car are designed for completely different missions.

MikeS · Sep 13, 2014

TonyWilliams said:
jadnashuanh said:

The base Tesla is rated at about 160-miles on a charge. So, depending on how you drive it, that 150-miles, could be an issue. Or, you can pony up another $25K (in the US) for the bigger battery, and end up paying more than twice the price of an i3.

Click to expand...

Are you kidding? The base Tesla has a 60kWh battery (three times the i3) and an EPA rated 208 mile range.

The 85kWh Tesla is $10,000 USD more for 265 miles.

160 miles would be very easy in a Model S.

Plus, those 25kW to 44kW chargers CCS chargers are not much competition for the 135kW Supercharger network.

You get what you pay for.

However, if you live in the UK and listened to the recent Radio 4 consumer programme about the Tesla battery reducing ability to take a charge I think you would avoid them :twisted:

Ardie · Sep 13, 2014

nowtta60,

While I've been driving an i3+REx for over 4,500 miles now, I have yet to take a trip that exhausts both the battery and the 8-liter fuel tank. Can't say if it is what my trips just happen to be, or whether I look at iffy trips and I shrink from even attempting the task, but there you have it. Here in the US, the REx only kicks in when the battery is down to about 6% (3-4 miles), so I would be in dire straits indeed, if I ran totally out of petrol.

Nevertheless, the two guess-o-meters may help you decide.
My commute in the morning allows me to zoom to work where portions of the freeway lets me rocket along at speeds in excess of 70 mph. Sometimes 80. My battery's guess-o-meter's range shrivels to a scant 60-65 miles. And it is (sadly) correct to within 5 miles. (As I drive with a steel-nerved carpool partner, I keep the climate control in Comfort mode. For their benefit, of course. But at these speeds, the ECO-Pro won't be of much help.)

My REx's guess-o-meter follows suit and adjusts the gasoline range accordingly down to about 60 more miles.
So my total is about 120-125 miles at death-defying speeds of 70-80 mph over reasonably level ground.

When I reduce the velocity to a more sane (=less fun) 70-ish, the range is upped to the middle 70's. Given that the REx range does the same, I am now clearly stuck in the car for almost 15 minutes longer, but the upside is that I can do it without having to stop (diapers notwithstanding).

---

Now, this is in the God-forsaken wastelands of Southern California, where the winters can be merciless plunging to the 40°F (4°C) and summers are soaring to over 100°F (38°C). The heater and air conditioner will sap your range, but I cannot say how much. I've never given up my Comfort mode to experiment on how it may extend range at the cost of keeping the car's cabin at temperatures below that of melting plastic sippy cups.

Secondly, we all know, but push it to the back of our minds, that batteries degrade over time and use, so after a number of years (8? 10?), the battery will have degraded to about 80% of its original capacity. Your trip may no longer be doable in a single bound. But your offspring will be a 10-year old fidgeter, and need a stop anyway.

---

If you have doubts, and the werewithal, then I would probably steer you to a Tesla Model S. At a range of over 250 miles, your range anxiety will totally evaporate. Be forewarned that the Model S is a BIG car, and will not be so handy in car parks, downtown areas, and perhaps your own garage.

-- Ardie

Chrisn · Sep 13, 2014

Agree that Tesla Model S is unlikely to be cross-shopped versus the i3. Most people with the garage capacity would be better served by an i3 and an X5 for similar money.

mabooker76 · Sep 16, 2014

So I volunteer at the San Diego Model Railroad Museum once a month, and took my Rex to do that trip from Altadena to Balboa Park (137 mi. according to Google) the first Sunday in September (75 degrees). Starting out on city streets into Pasadena, then a 60ish speed through downtown LA, then set the cruise at 68 for the rest of the drive down the I5 (steely nerves in hand as a fair amount of the traffic wizzed pasted me). All this in Eco Pro mode. Altadena is at the base of the San Gabriel foothills, and it is essentially 'downhill' to San Diego through some pretty good rolling hills. I got 78 miles into the trip before the Rex kicked in, and when I stopped in San Diego to fill up the gas tank it took approximately 1.2 gallons.

Used a level 2 Bink to recharge as I was there all day.

Returning was definitely more 'uphill', traffic was heavier so probably averaged about 65, but I had a quarter of a tank left when I got home, 271 miles in total. Since the European version of the car holds more petrol, this should get you through?

Martin

WoodlandHills · Sep 16, 2014

How did the car perform on the last leg going home? Was the battery below 6% and how did the ReX do going up the last hills? I am wondering if it would be possible to maintain 60 to 65 the 154 miles from my house up the 101 to Morro Bay and then returning to our place in the hills. We ordered a ReX to replace a pair of smarts to use as a city car, but if it has greater capabilities it could replace our Infiniti as well.

drb · Sep 17, 2014

I frequently drive from my home in Huntington Beach to Calabasas and even to Oxnard and return with no difficulty in my REx. If I go to Oxnard, I will top off the battery over lunch giving me sufficient range to make the trip without any intervening stops. We gave up an Infiniti SUV and a Lexus LS460L and have no regrets.

Chrisn · Sep 17, 2014

I am wondering if it would be possible to maintain 60 to 65 the 154 miles from my house up the 101 to Morro Bay and then returning to our place in the hills.[/quote said:
On the range issue, I think that would be a real stretch. I assume you mean a round trip, but the hills/elevation changes will still cost you in efficiency (regen not 100% efficient / ePower efficiency declines faster-than-linearly) with load.

I have been highly critical of ReX mode and hills, but, on the speed on hills issue, if you plan ahead and pay attention you can manage most hills. Just make sure to drive slowly (55-60) in the first few minutes after ReX starts (warm-up period). Then, pay constant attention to the remaining juice. If you get lower than half-way point between the arrow and zero, SLOW DOWN, but not below 56 MPH (so ReX runs full speed). Don't speed up again until you're 3/4 of the way back toward the arrow. Your steady-state speed will depend on the grade, but 60-65 mph should be doable in modest rolling hills. If I were BMW, I would have put up a warning at 50% between arrow and zero: "Drive moderately to avoid reduced propulsion mode" (or whatever) so you didn't have to obsess on the blue bar when driving hills in ReX mode....

WoodlandHills · Sep 17, 2014

Thanks for the response. I was planning on doing the trip as two separate journeys, long weekend style, starting each one with full gas and full SOC. We usually get a house from VRBO and spend the day touring wineries. I am hoping a dryer adapter and an AV Turbocord or the like will let me charge at 240v overnight. I was mostly worried about getting to 6% and then slowly running down to zero with the ReX whirring away. Those are very useful tips for power management when on the ReX. It's too bad there isn't a setting in the cruise control that would set the speed according to the ability to maintain charge, with a minimum speed for safety of course. Being able to engage the ReX at 80% like the rest of the world would be even better!

WoodlandHills · Sep 17, 2014

drb said:
I frequently drive from my home in Huntington Beach to Calabasas and even to Oxnard and return with no difficulty in my REx. If I go to Oxnard, I will top off the battery over lunch giving me sufficient range to make the trip without any intervening stops. We gave up an Infiniti SUV and a Lexus LS460L and have no regrets.

Are you running the a/c in Comfort or EcoPro? I am assuming that you finish a trip to Oxnard with the ReX running, any problems or issues? I would love to get rid of our SUV!

nowtta60 · Sep 17, 2014

Sadly I've kind if reached the conclusion I'm gonna have to cancel my order and hang on for a while longer b4 I take the electric plunge. I'm going to be doing this trip for the foreseable future as Im moving to the south coast and I have a sone who lives with his mum up in the Midlands. As much as I loved the i3, its not quite there yet for my needs as an only car. I've got another car - a diesel xtrail which Im going to swap for an 2007 plate 520d touring instead, and hang on to that till someone comes out with an EV that can do 200 miles for under £50k.

I think the rex is a great idea for someones usage profile where they use about 75% of the battery everyday or less, and need the occsaional long trip.

I have driven the model S, and possibly could afford one in a years time, but am not really convinced I want to spend over £60k on a car. I was considering going for a base spec 60kWH which is "just" £50k until folks on the Telsa forum pointed out it might struggle with 150 miles plus a few errands depending on the weather and traffic speeds. And you need to spend another £2k to get supercharging. By which time you may as well stump up the £5k to go to 85kWh, and as you are now at £57k £5k extra for electric pack and other bits doesnt seem that bad. LOL. I will be watching closely where they put the superchargers. One near the M40/A34 intersction could convince me to get a 60kWh S as its half way.

My aspiration is to still go EV asap as I love the experience. One of the things nagging me with the i3 was the need to use the rex regularly, I worked out I'd do about 6,000 miles a year with unleaded. Which isnt really getting cheap rate electric. If I'm lucky BMW will announce an i4 with a decent sized pack (no rex needed) to go up against the Tesla model 3 and both will come in close to £40k with some options and leave me with a quandry, as there will be a used Model S to throw in there too. We might even get a 50kWh i3 to pick from with newer lighter and cheaper batteries from the next incremental generation of LiIon.

If things dont change much I can still see us getting an i3 BEV as a second car for my OH who should have passed her test by then. Cant really see her driving the Telsa as she wont be able to see over the dash without a booster cushion, LOL.

Is 150 miles possible at motorway speeds?

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